Evo 4g/Evo 3D

[gTen]

Originally Posted by BlackDynamite

It was no different from the Evo. The G2 went back to stock, the Evo didn't let you make the change in the first place. The rooting technique is the same for both- use a temporary root method, and then flash a new image during the recovery which allows for a more permanent change. When the Evo was first rooted, it was only a temporary root that didn't even survive a reboot, and it ran automatically every time the device rebooted.

umm...just because the same technique is used does not mean there is no difference..its like cooking a fish and a pig...just cause both require you to cut them with a knife does not mean that its an identical process...

Let me give an example, on most other devices, I can use the same root method 100% with 0 modification...on G2 you saying if I swap the bootloader and follow the Evo instructions 100% it will work? I think not...

And that doesn't change my point at all. Not sure why you even mentioned it. Look at xda. Heck look at this very site. Sense is being tossed around in almost every ROM thread on both of these sites. Even unreleased versions of Sense, and versions from other devices. Yet neither site has heard a peep from HTC. In fact, both sites keep getting "leaked" versions of HTC updates/ROMs/Sense/etc to play with long before they even get officially released. You think these sites are just on an incredible lucky streak to somehow get every single HTC update and ROM for every device long before it gets released? I tend to think the simplest answer is usually the correct answer- occams razor.

um..leaks are not uncommon.I mean it only requires 1 employee with access and willingness to share...as for C&D, due to new judge ruling it makes it harder..but overall HTC has nothing to gain in going after xda and ppcg...if anything it will get them bad publicity...

In this case, that would be that HTC is the friendliest manufacturer to hackers and they leak these on purpose directly to the people who can actually do something with it.

um..what do you base this on exactly? all the other manufacturers give us as much resources as HTC and more..HTC has even yet to release source code on a few devices aka violating the GPL..some other manufacturers give us source code even before device comes out. Not to mention leaks and etc..leaks are not that uncommon..so I wouldnt call HTC the most dev friendly when other manufacturers are definitely more dev friendly.

It's not at all like that, lol. HTC leaking ROMs is not even comparable to anyone else leaking ROMs. Like I said, we had the latest version of Sense running on Evo's several months ago (thanks to leaked ROMs from other devices). We've had the Evo's gingerbread ROM (sense and all) leaked and running for a while now too. And not a peep from HTC. It's actually expected that pretty much every HTC device will have it's software hacked and ported to older devices. And it usually happens before the device is even released.

You do know that Galaxy S and Droid X got gingerbread leaks before the Evo did right? so how can you call it not being comparable....

Things get ported to older devices because HTC has a HUGE dev community due to HTC being the ONLY choice mostly here in the US..times re changing..we have choice now...

HTC will never go to an efuse. Again, they have not made any effort whatsoever to stop the hacking that goes on. On the contrary, they have "leaked" signed images for all of their devices which basically guarantees they will be hacked. If xda or ppcgeeks ever gets a cease and desist from HTC, then you will have a point. But they are the opposite. Not only are they not getting cease and desist letters, but they are getting ROMs, updates, software, etc, leaked every time there is something new.

By them locking the device more and more every time in itself proves they are making an effort..implementing tech like efuse is not so simple and requires licensing and etc..

The temp root is used to apply the permanent root. In a nutshell, the device gets temporarily rooted, and while it is rooted a new recovery image is flashed that has a signed image and allows flashing custom ROMs.

They aren't adding any more, lol. It's the same technique being used to root these phones.

They now have a signed recovery too...

When there is an HTC phone that can't be rooted, then you might have a point. But it seems pretty crazy to get all worried about it when every single one has been rooted, often before it was even released.

there is nothing that cant be rooted...as the saying goes "As long as you give physical access it can be compromised"..even the older Motorola devices can be rooted give an effort by the community..but thats not the point when they make it needlessly complicated posing devices to more bricks and etc..

I'll tell you what- you worry about it and I won't. When it gets released, we'll see if you wasted your time worrying about it, or if I wasted my time not worrying about it. Looking at the history, I'd say it's a pretty safe bet which one of us would have wasted their time and which one of us wouldn't have. There is no reason at all to worry about this. The next Evo will absolutely be rooted, and probably before it is even released.

I am not doubting that it will be rooted..but at the same time I am not doubting that it will be harder to root...as every single time the security of the phone goes up.

[BlackDynamite]

Originally Posted by gTen

umm...just because the same technique is used does not mean there is no difference..its like cooking a fish and a pig...just cause both require you to cut them with a knife does not mean that its an identical process...

It doesn't mean one is progressively harder to the point where we should be concerned that it might not be possible to cook the next one either.

Originally Posted by gTen

Let me give an example, on most other devices, I can use the same root method 100% with 0 modification...on G2 you saying if I swap the bootloader and follow the Evo instructions 100% it will work? I think not...

You seem to be stuck on the fact that that HTC devices are rooted differently. And you are wrong, by the way. There are a few rooting techniques for each device, and yes, some of them are identical with different files but the exact same instructions.

Originally Posted by gTen

um..leaks are not uncommon.I mean it only requires 1 employee with access and willingness to share...as for C&D, due to new judge ruling it makes it harder..but overall HTC has nothing to gain in going after xda and ppcg...if anything it will get them bad publicity...

Forget that new judge ruling. Xda and ppcgeeks have been in business long before that ruling, and HTC never went after them. The fact that HTC never went after them has nothing to do with that judge ruling. Like I said, I remember when Microsoft sent cease and desist letters to xda. HTC didn't.

Originally Posted by gTen

um..what do you base this on exactly? all the other manufacturers give us as much resources as HTC and more..HTC has even yet to release source code on a few devices aka violating the GPL..some other manufacturers give us source code even before device comes out. Not to mention leaks and etc..leaks are not that uncommon..so I wouldnt call HTC the most dev friendly when other manufacturers are definitely more dev friendly.

I base it on the fact that HTC always gives the community the tools needed to hack their phones, has never tried to stop the hacking, and leaks all of their ROMs and updates giving the community plenty of time to prepare for whatever security techniques are being used.

Originally Posted by gTen

You do know that Galaxy S and Droid X got gingerbread leaks before the Evo did right? so how can you call it not being comparable....

And I know that we not only had the new Sense leaked by that time, but we already had custom ROMs created and flashed for the Evo running the new Sense over a week before the first Galaxy S Gingerbread leak. And Froyo for the Evo leaked way before it did for the Galaxy S.

Originally Posted by gTen

Things get ported to older devices because HTC has a HUGE dev community due to HTC being the ONLY choice mostly here in the US..times re changing..we have choice now...

And yet xda is still the biggest site with mostly HTC related traffic and forums, and lots if international users. I'm not buying it.

Originally Posted by gTen

By them locking the device more and more every time in itself proves they are making an effort..implementing tech like efuse is not so simple and requires licensing and etc..

They aren't locking it more and more every time, lol. It's the same technique on pretty much all of them.

Originally Posted by gTen

They now have a signed recovery too...

That's nothing new. It's been a signed recovery for a while now. Lucky for us they "leak" a signed version that we can replace it with.

Originally Posted by gTen

there is nothing that cant be rooted...as the saying goes "As long as you give physical access it can be compromised"..even the older Motorola devices can be rooted give an effort by the community..but thats not the point when they make it needlessly complicated posing devices to more bricks and etc..

That's not true. There are motorola devices that can't have custom ROMs to this day. Sure they might get cracked at some point well after the device lifespan has already ended. But we're talking abotu HTC devices that are always rooted either before the device is released or within a day after it getting released.

Originally Posted by gTen

I am not doubting that it will be rooted..but at the same time I am not doubting that it will be harder to root...as every single time the security of the phone goes up.

It has not been harder to root every single time, lol. It has been the same technique. If by harder you mean "typing lots of things into a command line when the last device had 1 click root" then I say wait and 1 click root will be made, just like it was for every other device before it. If you are talking about the actual technique that makes root access possible, then it is the same technique used on all of these devices. they are all locked and signed, they all use a temporary root and then flash a signed recovery while temporarily rooted.

Again, I reiterate, there is no reason to worry. The Evo 3D absolutely WILL be rooted, probably before it is even released. Anyone saying they will hold off on purchasing the Evo 3D because they are worried about it possibly not getting rooted, is worrying about a non issue. HTC has been very kind to the community over the many years of them making smartphones. I see absolutely no reason why that should suddenly change.

I find it hillarious that someone would say everyone should be worried about an HTC device not being able to be rooted, and they cite for evidence a bunch of HTC devices that were rooted either before they were even released or within a day of getting released.

Yeah, the Evo 3D might be harder to root. That means I might have to type in adb a little bit to root it on day 1 or I will have to wait a day for the 1 click root. lol

[gTen]

Originally Posted by BlackDynamite

It doesn't mean one is progressively harder to the point where we should be concerned that it might not be possible to cook the next one either.

Again I am saying nothing is impossible to root and get a custom rom on.. remember the ps3 was said to be unhackable and got hacked...its a matter of having a strong enough community, resources and time.

You seem to be stuck on the fact that that HTC devices are rooted differently. And you are wrong, by the way. There are a few rooting techniques for each device, and yes, some of them are identical with different files but the exact same instructions.

Because they are...

Forget that new judge ruling. Xda and ppcgeeks have been in business long before that ruling, and HTC never went after them. The fact that HTC never went after them has nothing to do with that judge ruling. Like I said, I remember when Microsoft sent cease and desist letters to xda. HTC didn't.

All I am saying is as HTC has been growing bigger they have been changing..its nothing new..I mean a year ago most people would not have seen M$ doing what they did with WP7..yet they did..you cant tell me a Hero for example is same rooting method that an Evo...and we know G2 has the new recovery thing going..its indisputable that they are increasing it...and we dont know by how much...this doesnt mean that we wont be able to root it..it just makes it a bigger pain.

I base it on the fact that HTC always gives the community the tools needed to hack their phones, has never tried to stop the hacking, and leaks all of their ROMs and updates giving the community plenty of time to prepare for whatever security techniques are being used.

But so do the manufacturers...but they dont put signed bootloaders to begin with.

And I know that we not only had the new Sense leaked by that time, but we already had custom ROMs created and flashed for the Evo running the new Sense over a week before the first Galaxy S Gingerbread leak. And Froyo for the Evo leaked way before it did for the Galaxy S.

um..you do know that the first Gingerbread leak for the Galaxy S was in February..thats even before nexus one got gingerbread..by the time Evo got its first leak, Gingerbread already hit official release on the Galaxy S.

And yet xda is still the biggest site with mostly HTC related traffic and forums, and lots if international users. I'm not buying it.

HTC was effectively one of the only choices for winmo and android for a huge amount of time..and as early devices were easy to hack thus spur the growth...back when xda first came out, HTC didnt even release phones under their own brand...

They aren't locking it more and more every time, lol. It's the same technique on pretty much all of them.

That's nothing new. It's been a signed recovery for a while now. Lucky for us they "leak" a signed version that we can replace it with.

That's not true. There are motorola devices that can't have custom ROMs to this day. Sure they might get cracked at some point well after the device lifespan has already ended. But we're talking abotu HTC devices that are always rooted either before the device is released or within a day after it getting released.

The devices that are unhackable are older gen and just didnt have the community to support them..if we wanted to we could hack them...trust me...also it took months to get custom roms on a G2...

It has not been harder to root every single time, lol. It has been the same technique. If by harder you mean "typing lots of things into a command line when the last device had 1 click root" then I say wait and 1 click root will be made, just like it was for every other device before it. If you are talking about the actual technique that makes root access possible, then it is the same technique used on all of these devices. they are all locked and signed, they all use a temporary root and then flash a signed recovery while temporarily rooted.

Again, I reiterate, there is no reason to worry. The Evo 3D absolutely WILL be rooted, probably before it is even released. Anyone saying they will hold off on purchasing the Evo 3D because they are worried about it possibly not getting rooted, is worrying about a non issue. HTC has been very kind to the community over the many years of them making smartphones. I see absolutely no reason why that should suddenly change.

I find it hillarious that someone would say everyone should be worried about an HTC device not being able to be rooted, and they cite for evidence a bunch of HTC devices that were rooted either before they were even released or within a day of getting released.

Yeah, the Evo 3D might be harder to root. That means I might have to type in adb a little bit to root it on day 1 or I will have to wait a day for the 1 click root. lol

The thunderbolt took 72 hours to root after it came out...thats not next day...I am not saying that itll be impossible but I guarantee you its going to get harder and harder by trend..

[BlackDynamite]

Originally Posted by gTen

Again I am saying nothing is impossible to root and get a custom rom on.. remember the ps3 was said to be unhackable and got hacked...its a matter of having a strong enough community, resources and time.

Again, there are several motorola devices that right now can't have a custom ROM. Devices that are already past their end of life, so nobody even cares about them anymore. Meaning they went their entire regular life cycle without anyone figuring out how to put a custom ROM on there. That has never happened with HTC. Most HTC phones are rooted before they are even released.

Originally Posted by gTen

All I am saying is as HTC has been growing bigger they have been changing..its nothing new..I mean a year ago most people would not have seen M$ doing what they did with WP7..yet they did..you cant tell me a Hero for example is same rooting method that an Evo...and we know G2 has the new recovery thing going..its indisputable that they are increasing it...and we dont know by how much...this doesnt mean that we wont be able to root it..it just makes it a bigger pain.

I don't know about the Hero and what they used to root it (was on a Touch Pro 2 back then) but I know the Evo, Thunderbolt, and G2 are all rooted the same way. And the recovery being locked on the G2 is no different than the recovery on the Evo or Thunderbolt being locked. All were rooted using the same technique, and nobody had to wait for it on any of those devices.

Originally Posted by gTen

But so do the manufacturers...but they dont put signed bootloaders to begin with.

Motorola does. I don't know who else does or doesn't, but I know HTC is certainly not the only ones. HTC does give the key to unlock it though (they "leak" it at least in the form of a "test" recovery image).

Originally Posted by gTen

um..you do know that the first Gingerbread leak for the Galaxy S was in February..thats even before nexus one got gingerbread..by the time Evo got its first leak, Gingerbread already hit official release on the Galaxy S.

Yes, I know that the Gingerbread leak for the Galaxy S was on February 28. I also know there is a ROM on this very site for the Evo running the newest Sense. And that ROM was last updated on February 23. So they not only had the files before then, but they the files long enough before then to have a ROM compiled for the Evo that was good enough to not even be updated since February 23. I also know the Desire's Gingerbread ROM leaked out a week later, March 7.

Originally Posted by gTen

HTC was effectively one of the only choices for winmo and android for a huge amount of time..and as early devices were easy to hack thus spur the growth...back when xda first came out, HTC didnt even release phones under their own brand...

I'm not disputing any of that. What I am disputing is your claim that HTC is no longer friendly to the hacking community. They most definitely are. It's hillarious that you would even make such a claim when every HTC phone is hacked, mostly before they are even released.

Originally Posted by gTen

The devices that are unhackable are older gen and just didnt have the community to support them..if we wanted to we could hack them...trust me...also it took months to get custom roms on a G2...

Wrong again, lol. Yes, there are older gen devices that were never able to have custom ROMs, but there are newer devices that still can't have them (Motorola Bravo).

Originally Posted by gTen

The thunderbolt took 72 hours to root after it came out...thats not next day...I am not saying that itll be impossible but I guarantee you its going to get harder and harder by trend..

Wrong again, lol. TRhe Thunderbolt was rooted before it was even released. See this, dated 3-18-2011, with instructions on how to do it (the device started shipping 3-17-11):
[Exclusive] How To Root The HTC Thunderbolt – Instructions By Team AndIRC (V1.02 2011/03/1 | Android News, Reviews, Apps, Games, Phones, Tablets, Tips, Mods, Videos, Tutorials - Android Police
Release date info:
HTC Thunderbolt Release Date Here - Verizon... | Gather


Lets revisit how this all got started... Someone said they would not preorder the device because they thought it might not get rooted. I said that was not anything that I'm worried about. You then said we should be worried about it. It appears that you now concede the device will be rooted, either before it is released or in very short order after it is released.

[gTen]

Originally Posted by BlackDynamite

Again, there are several motorola devices that right now can't have a custom ROM. Devices that are already past their end of life, so nobody even cares about them anymore. Meaning they went their entire regular life cycle without anyone figuring out how to put a custom ROM on there. That has never happened with HTC. Most HTC phones are rooted before they are even released.

Because those devices were not popular...popularity plays a huge roll in the speed the community releases stuff..the devices in question could be rooted if there was a demand for it..aka if next Droid X had it, it would be rooted.

I don't know about the Hero and what they used to root it (was on a Touch Pro 2 back then) but I know the Evo, Thunderbolt, and G2 are all rooted the same way. And the recovery being locked on the G2 is no different than the recovery on the Evo or Thunderbolt being locked. All were rooted using the same technique, and nobody had to wait for it on any of those devices.

There was a wait on custom roms for the g2..it too a month for them to get perma root and break the emmc.

Motorola does. I don't know who else does or doesn't, but I know HTC is certainly not the only ones. HTC does give the key to unlock it though (they "leak" it at least in the form of a "test" recovery image).

To my knowledge HTC and Motorola are only ones..LG, Samsung, Asus, viewsonic are all unsigned...heck Sony even does unsigned bootloaders and is now offering a website that tells people how to unlock their bootloaders...

Yes, I know that the Gingerbread leak for the Galaxy S was on February 28. I also know there is a ROM on this very site for the Evo running the newest Sense. And that ROM was last updated on February 23. So they not only had the files before then, but they the files long enough before then to have a ROM compiled for the Evo that was good enough to not even be updated since February 23. I also know the Desire's Gingerbread ROM leaked out a week later, March 7.

I am looking around and I can't find the feb 23rd.only feb 23 rom I found with new sense is still 2.2....as for march 7th..by then there was already 3 leaked gingerbread roms for i9000...

I'm not disputing any of that. What I am disputing is your claim that HTC is no longer friendly to the hacking community. They most definitely are. It's hillarious that you would even make such a claim when every HTC phone is hacked, mostly before they are even released.

IF you call locking you up in jail then giving you a key friendly be my guest :/...if other manufacturers are getting away with it unsigned, why not HTC?

Wrong again, lol. Yes, there are older gen devices that were never able to have custom ROMs, but there are newer devices that still can't have them (Motorola Bravo).

As I said its a supply and demand thing..there is not a big enough demand/community to support those devices at the technical level it requires...

Wrong again, lol. TRhe Thunderbolt was rooted before it was even released. See this, dated 3-18-2011, with instructions on how to do it (the device started shipping 3-17-11):
[Exclusive] How To Root The HTC Thunderbolt – Instructions By Team AndIRC (V1.02 2011/03/1 | Android News, Reviews, Apps, Games, Phones, Tablets, Tips, Mods, Videos, Tutorials - Android Police
Release date info:
HTC Thunderbolt Release Date Here - Verizon... | Gather

um..not your just not reading what you wrote..you wrote that it was rooted before it was released and that it was reeased on 17th and rooted 18th..how is that before? also the release date was bumped up to 16th due to the ipad2 thing...aka many people got it on 16th...

Lets revisit how this all got started... Someone said they would not preorder the device because they thought it might not get rooted. I said that was not anything that I'm worried about. You then said we should be worried about it. It appears that you now concede the device will be rooted, either before it is released or in very short order after it is released.

I never said it wont be rooted..I just said there is no guarantee that it will be rooted so fast due to HTC's trend of increasing the security...and as stated it took 1 month for G2 to get perma root...originally the user wanted to wait a bit after rooting which I agreed with as there is no guarantee on how long it would take for "perma root"

[BlackDynamite]

Originally Posted by gTen

Because those devices were not popular...popularity plays a huge roll in the speed the community releases stuff..the devices in question could be rooted if there was a demand for it..aka if next Droid X had it, it would be rooted.

To my knowledge, nobody has found a crack for the efuse.

Originally Posted by gTen

There was a wait on custom roms for the g2..it too a month for them to get perma root and break the emmc.

The G2 was rooted before it was even released. It was the same temporary root the Evo used, and basically every other HTC phone. It may very well have been a month before anyone made a custom ROM for it (I know Cyanogen was released a month later, don't know if anyone else made a ROM before that or not) but the device was rooted before it was even released, as pretty much all HTC phones are. Temp root that automatically starts and reroots as part of the boot process, or perma root that stays rooted, who cares. The bottom line is you have root access to your device either way and can run any of the root apps from the market.

Originally Posted by gTen

To my knowledge HTC and Motorola are only ones..LG, Samsung, Asus, viewsonic are all unsigned...heck Sony even does unsigned bootloaders and is now offering a website that tells people how to unlock their bootloaders...

So what? What does it matter if HTC puts a locked bootloader if they release the key before the device is even released? You seem stuck on that for some reason but it's a non issue to me. And no matter how many times you say it, it will remain a non issue. Until HTC releases a device without a way to unlock the bootloader, then it's a non issue.

Originally Posted by gTen

I am looking around and I can't find the feb 23rd.only feb 23 rom I found with new sense is still 2.2....as for march 7th..by then there was already 3 leaked gingerbread roms for i9000...

Yes, it was still froyo but it had the new HTC sense. I didn't realize you were turning it into a competition about which device had Gingerbread first. I was simply talking about leaked software to the community. if you want to talk about OS version updates, then lets compare when my Evo got froyo to when your Epic got it. I know you don't want to go there though. We can also talk about GPS issues with the galaxy S and how long it took to get that resolved. Now if we go back to my original point, that HTC is good to the hacking community, then the fact that there was an Evo ROM running the latest version of Sense back in February is pretty dang impressive. And if we're only talking about Gingerbread, I see a CM7 download for the Evo dated 2-16-11. When was the first Epic Gingerbread ROM? Cyanogen doesn't even support the Galaxy S.

Originally Posted by gTen

IF you call locking you up in jail then giving you a key friendly be my guest :/...if other manufacturers are getting away with it unsigned, why not HTC?

It's nothing like being locked up in jail. Being locked up in jail would be more like waiting for Samsung to issue the Epic Froyo update, or fix that broken GPS. HTC releasing the signed image to get around it before the device even being released is fine with me.

Originally Posted by gTen

As I said its a supply and demand thing..there is not a big enough demand/community to support those devices at the technical level it requires...

I agree. But then why did you bring it up? Do you think there won't be a lot of interest in the new Evo or something? I mean, you were the one saying we should be concerned that the new Evo won't be rooted, even though just about every HTC device gets rooted before it's even released.

Originally Posted by gTen

um..not your just not reading what you wrote..you wrote that it was rooted before it was released and that it was reeased on 17th and rooted 18th..how is that before? also the release date was bumped up to 16th due to the ipad2 thing...aka many people got it on 16th...

Uh, no. It started shipping that date (preorders). Nobody had one yet.

Originally Posted by gTen

I never said it wont be rooted..I just said there is no guarantee that it will be rooted so fast due to HTC's trend of increasing the security...and as stated it took 1 month for G2 to get perma root...originally the user wanted to wait a bit after rooting which I agreed with as there is no guarantee on how long it would take for "perma root"

HTC's security is not increased, lol. If you do the research, you will find that the G2 was rooted before it was even released, using the same method that worked on almost every other HTC phone. It's a total non issue.

Care to make a wager on it? I bet you the Evo 3D is rooted within a week of launch (likely before it even launches, but I'll say with a week after launch to be safe). Care to bet on it?

I will say again, this all started when someone else said they weren't going to preorder the Evo 3D out of concern that it wouldn't be rooted, I said it was a non issue, and you said it was something we should be concerned about. So that guy IS betting that it won't be rooted. He will likely miss out on the original shipment (remember how long the Evo stayed sold out). That is his wager. I'm just trying to help the guy out by letting him know the real deal- it is pretty much guaranteed to be rooted within a week after release, and probably before it is even released. And from the sounds of it, you actually agree that it is likely to be rooted by then, but continue to argue because you don't like HTC for some reason.

[gTen]

Originally Posted by BlackDynamite

To my knowledge, nobody has found a crack for the efuse.

its a matter of time till someone finds one..wait till oen shows up in a major device..then we will see..

The G2 was rooted before it was even released. It was the same temporary root the Evo used, and basically every other HTC phone. It may very well have been a month before anyone made a custom ROM for it (I know Cyanogen was released a month later, don't know if anyone else made a ROM before that or not) but the device was rooted before it was even released, as pretty much all HTC phones are. Temp root that automatically starts and reroots as part of the boot process, or perma root that stays rooted, who cares. The bottom line is you have root access to your device either way and can run any of the root apps from the market.

I dont think the G2 was able to reroot itself on boot..

So what? What does it matter if HTC puts a locked bootloader if they release the key before the device is even released? You seem stuck on that for some reason but it's a non issue to me. And no matter how many times you say it, it will remain a non issue. Until HTC releases a device without a way to unlock the bootloader, then it's a non issue.

Because they change bootloaders in the middle and cause everyone to brick? I mean why do it in the first place? and locked bootloader and signed is a different thing..I am talking about signed here..

Yes, it was still froyo but it had the new HTC sense. I didn't realize you were turning it into a competition about which device had Gingerbread first. I was simply talking about leaked software to the community. if you want to talk about OS version updates, then lets compare when my Evo got froyo to when your Epic got it.

I was not..you played the time card first so I reiterated..its obviosu galaxy s would get ginger first and evo would get froyo first..due to who made which Nexus device.

I know you don't want to go there though. We can also talk about GPS issues with the galaxy S and how long it took to get that resolved.

Every phone has its issues..Galaxy S still has issues and Evo still has issues..its nothing new...

Now if we go back to my original point, that HTC is good to the hacking community, then the fact that there was an Evo ROM running the latest version of Sense back in February is pretty dang impressive.

umm...why? didnt they port a Desire Z rom with it?

And if we're only talking about Gingerbread, I see a CM7 download for the Evo dated 2-16-11. When was the first Epic Gingerbread ROM? Cyanogen doesn't even support the Galaxy S.

Again as I said it boils down to the community..right now we are up to Alpha 4 so until it reaches stable it wont be official..but the community is growing at a rapid rate. Either way this isnt about any device in specific..we are talking about manufacturers are we not?

It's nothing like being locked up in jail. Being locked up in jail would be more like waiting for Samsung to issue the Epic Froyo update, or fix that broken GPS. HTC releasing the signed image to get around it before the device even being released is fine with me.

I find it alarming in itself that if for whatever reason a leak is not released would spell trouble..the reliance on HTC releasing it is pretty big that if 1 day they chose not to release it youd be screwed...

I agree. But then why did you bring it up? Do you think there won't be a lot of interest in the new Evo or something? I mean, you were the one saying we should be concerned that the new Evo won't be rooted, even though just about every HTC device gets rooted before it's even released.

I am saying there is a possibility for it to take longer to root...

Uh, no. It started shipping that date (preorders). Nobody had one yet.

People were able to get their hands on it earlier then that..aka 16th and either way, last I checked 17th comes before 18th...you said it was rooted before it came out...which was not the case...

HTC's security is not increased, lol. If you do the research, you will find that the G2 was rooted before it was even released, using the same method that worked on almost every other HTC phone. It's a total non issue.

as stated before..they had to manually redo the root if they reset their phones...

Care to make a wager on it? I bet you the Evo 3D is rooted within a week of launch (likely before it even launches, but I'll say with a week after launch to be safe). Care to bet on it?

I will say again, this all started when someone else said they weren't going to preorder the Evo 3D out of concern that it wouldn't be rooted, I said it was a non issue, and you said it was something we should be concerned about. So that guy IS betting that it won't be rooted. He will likely miss out on the original shipment (remember how long the Evo stayed sold out). That is his wager. I'm just trying to help the guy out by letting him know the real deal- it is pretty much guaranteed to be rooted within a week after release, and probably before it is even released. And from the sounds of it, you actually agree that it is likely to be rooted by then, but continue to argue because you don't like HTC for some reason.

Oh I am not disagreeing with you there is a risk of it being sold out, but thats not what was mentioned before..that risk exists and one I actually forgotten about..either way I was referring to rooting only...

Since the debate dragged on I'd like to reiterate what exactly I am disagreeing with and what I am agreeing with.

I agree that:
-It will be rooted eventually

-Delaying purchase may cause availability issues

I disagree that:
-HTC is in fact getting harder by the device...this has been a growing trend for already over 5 years..Apache was completely open, Mogul had to be hardSPL, Touch pro and touch pro2 were worse and it kept getting harder and harder..at what point it will go over the edge is unknown to me, it may be on Evo 3d it may be the device 5 years later..or maybe theyll change their mind and take a step back..but the evidence is there in trend.

-I disagree with your statement that HTC is the most developer friendly..it has nothing to do with hating or liking HTC...The other manufacturers offer the same amount of support as HTC does and some even better support then HTC does..your bases for HTC being the most developer friendly is based on them releasing software which 90% of the other manufacturers already do and more...If anything I would like if people view the playing field more fairly towards all manufacturers..I am not asking you to think HTC is the worst or the best but look at the current reality of things. For one, there is no way I would call any manufacturer developer friendly if they dont follow the GPL...

[shane6374]

Originally Posted by gTen

I dont think the G2 was able to reroot itself on boot..

Actually BlackDynamite is correct on this one. Visionary + temp root can be set to reroot the phone on each boot. In fact it is by far the easiest way to root the phone. The perm root method on that phone is a pain in the a$$, and I wish I wouldn't have done it. It's even harder to reverse.

[gTen]

Originally Posted by shane6374

Actually BlackDynamite is correct on this one. Visionary + temp root can be set to reroot the phone on each boot. In fact it is by far the easiest way to root the phone. The perm root method on that phone is a pain in the a$$, and I wish I wouldn't have done it. It's even harder to reverse.

I was looking at old articles and that one said It had to be applied manually every time..tried to Google for auto reroot in different ways and didnt see anything...

After googling for the name you provided I found that it does in fact exist. and came out 4 days after release..so I concede on that statement then.

[shane6374]

Originally Posted by gTen

I was looking at old articles and that one said It had to be applied manually every time..tried to Google for auto reroot in different ways and didnt see anything...

After googling for the name you provided I found that it does in fact exist. and came out 4 days after release..so I concede on that statement then.

I'm with you on all of your other points. I've also enjoyed reading the debate the two of you are having.

I'm not sure on the difference on locking the devices between WinMo and android, but I can say this for sure. I've put different roms on 6 different phones (Vogue, TP2, HD2, Evo, Epic, and G2). By far the easiest was the Epic. The Evo and G2 were by far the most difficult.

What I am considering when I say that is starting at Rooting or installing the hspl though successfully booting up the new rom.