Diamonds on eBay

[movax]

Ahh, I see...very "clever" insurance fraud stuff then.

I would say its safe to assume that it took the 6 days "handling" time + next-day air shipping to wait for the phone to dropship or something. That's probably why it came from a "Sprint warehouse" in Kentucky, plus the Asurion slip...

That ##786# is handy, didn't know about that! Mine shows not refurbed, brand-new entirely. However, original activation date is empty - because I did it online?

OT, I need to update my ROM, mine is from October.

[joeyjoe]

Originally Posted by boxermansr

Tried to post this awhile ago, but the page kept timing out, so I'll just copy/paste what I posted over on another forum.. This is what I *think* is going on with these claims, and what not.

We'll use three people, John, Paul, and Joe (makes it easier, hah), who are the buyers, and we'll say the seller is Dave.

Dave lists Touch PRO's (or diamonds) for sale. John, Paul and Joe all pay for them. Dave doesn't disclose to his buyers that someone else will actually be shipping the phones to the buyers (in this case, Dave himself, doesn't even know that the phones that.. we'll say Steve (the one whos filing the claims with Asurion/Sprint), is shipping, are in fact being obtained via fraud).

Now, to make the most sense of this, we'll say that all three buyers HAVE insurance, here's how *I* think it's working out, as far as claims go.

Steve gets the orders from Dave (name to ship to, address, etc). Steve himself (or someone who Steve has on the inside of Sprint) is obtaining account information (since Sprint AND Asurion both "claim" that the account holders PIN is needed to file a claim) - I don't see how else Steve could be getting that, unless he works for, or knows someone who works for Sprint.

Anyhow, Steve files a claim using John's account information (his wireless number and his account PIN, which he, as not yet determined, obtained). Instead of having that phone shipped to JOHN, that phones going to PAUL. Then, Steve files a claim on Paul's account with Paul's information, and has THAT phone shipped to JOE.

Now, we can't go past Joe, since we only defined three buyers here, but either Joe will get the phone that will be sent based off a claim of the next buyer, or Joe won't get anything at all (he'll end up getting a refund from the seller however).

Joe may not get his phone for a few reasons; mainly because Sprint/Asurion don't have Touch Pro's right now (or are getting them slowly back in stock).. however the scammer (Steve) may, or may not still go ahead and file a claim using Joe's information to fulfil the phone order for the next buyer. Joe will still end up not getting anything from the seller (who in this case is still Dave, since he's the one who listed the items).

Dave keeps trying at this point to contact Steve, who pretty much has up and vanished, so, Dave has to start refunding people. NOW.. IF Steve did file a claim with JOE's info, then Joe *is* going to see a 50.00 deductable charge on his next bill.

It has nothing to do with whether or not joe ever got a phone, it has to do with the fact that a CLAIM was filed on HIS account.

This is exactly what happened to ME. I purchased the phone, and ended up getting a refund. The scammer (Steve) still had my information that Dave (the seller) had forwarded to him when I paid, therefore, Steve went ahead and filed a claim with MY account, to fulfil someone else's purchase.

I try to think of this as a chain, it goes from one link to the next, and so on.. If my explaination sucks, I'm sorry, it's been a long day, and this is the best way I could think to explain it.

For those who have purchased from certain buyers, there's nothing that I can tell you will ENSURE that you will, or that you WON'T see a charge on your bill. If you DON'T have insurance on your account, most likely you WON'T be charged a deductable (you can't be, cuz you don't HAVE insurance) **BUT**, don't be surprised if Sprint does contact you, telling you that you have a device that was obtained via an insurance claim on someone elses account.

Asurion does have the ESN's of these devices, and I'm pretty sure at some point they will research where they went, and who's accounts they are on. It completely sucks that the innocent people get screwed here.

I managed to get the 50.00 deductable credited back, my next concern was them blacklisting the ESN on my current phone (since they were expecting a phone back from ME, based on the claim that was filed). They also took care of that, so I won't have to worry about the ESN being blacklisted either.

Anyhow, no need to drag this post on forever. In a nutshell, I think this is how the scam is working. Sucks for the original seller (but then again, it's probably not wise to let someone else handle your orders for you, and mess your feedback up), and it sucks for the buyers. The ones who get hit with the charges, and the ones who potentially will get calls from Sprint (I'm not saying anyone will, I don't work for Sprint, but as others have pointed out, Sprint and Asurion KNOW the ESN's of the replacements they send out). I can only hope, that to be fair to those folks, that Sprint works some type of deal out with them, since they were the unwitting victims of someone elses BS.

Also - that to those who are getting insurance flyers, and/or return kits in your box, that's there mainly because Sprint's expecting the "broken" phone that was claimed, in order to send you the new one, back in.

Just because they are there, doesn't mean that YOU will be hit with a charge (someone else probably already was, that being the person who's account the claim was filed UNDER).

As I said though, there COULD be a chance that in those cases Sprint does contact those people. Don't quote me on that, because as I said, I'm speculating. I just feel that anyone who THINKS it could happen, hold onto everything if you can (the box, any papers that came in it, etc).

I like your theory but it makes no sense. I purchased phones online from celldep0t and do not have insurance. I do not have my cell number online or given to the seller either. You should rethink your theory to include non insurance people such as myself that have been buying phones on Ebay since the PPC 6700 1st came out. Also for your theory to work everyone in the world would have to have insurance and the seller can only sell an even number of phones. A friend of mine referred me to celldep0t a few months ago. I been reading these forums because my girlfriend's sister told her about them. My conclusion is if you want something half price or cheaper than contract price there has to be some backdoor deal going on somehow or eBay would never have phones, tvs or anything much for that matter. If us buyers want to be 100% legit we really would have to go to Sprint or www.sprint.com and spend our rent money to make them billionaires. New customers get treated better than paying loyal 10 year customers.

[boxermansr]

Originally Posted by joeyjoe

I like your theory but it makes no sense. I purchased phones online from celldep0t and do not have insurance. I do not have my cell number online or given to the seller either. You should rethink your theory to include non insurance people such as myself that have been buying phones on Ebay since the PPC 6700 1st came out. Also for your theory to work everyone in the world would have to have insurance and the seller can only sell an even number of phones. A friend of mine referred me to celldep0t a few months ago. I been reading these forums because my girlfriend's sister told her about them. My conclusion is if you want something half price or cheaper than contract price there has to be some backdoor deal going on somehow or eBay would never have phones, tvs or anything much for that matter. If us buyers want to be 100% legit we really would have to go to Sprint or www.sprint.com and spend our rent money to make them billionaires. New customers get treated better than paying loyal 10 year customers.

Thats why I said for the PERFECT scenario, I'd say that everyone HAD insurance, I realize that everyone doesn't. How that's going to work out for buyers who got phones that were claimed on someone else's insurance, I have no idea. (In your case, not having insurance, I imagine you get a phone that was LIKELY claimed using someone elses account information). The phone you got, most lilkely is 100% free and clear, as none of this started (at least with celldep0t) until about 3 weeks ago or so (based on what I've heard from him at least).

All I know, is that SOMEONE got a phone that was claimed with MY insurance. I talked to the guy myself. As far as celldep0t, this whole mess just started a few weeks ago, another seller contacted celldep0t, offering to ship phones FOR him, at a lesser price. In the end, that person ended up screwing celldep0t, AND several of the people who got phones both from HIM (he was selling as dmilton111), and from people who got them directly from celldep0t (as dmilton111 either stopped shipping phones FOR celldep0t, or something else which I can't even begin to imagine).

As far as getting info, all the buyer needs to ship us a phone is our name and address, which they get when we pay (via paypal, or however). In this case, the seller was forwarding that info off to the person who was shipping phones FOR him (in this case, dmilton111). My theory speculates that dmilton himself, or someone he knew, used THAT information (the name, and the shipping address), to access the buyers Sprint account information (how, I don't know, but it HAS to be done, as in order to file a claim "supposidly" the person filing the claim has to know the account PIN of account holder that is filing the claim).

Now, I don't know anyone who buys a phone and provides the seller their PIN and any pertinent passowords to their account on top of it, but somehow, someONE got that information, which was needed to submit the claim.

I know I got a 50.00 charge. I know where the phone that was claimed was shipped to. I talked to the person who got the phone, they purchased from the same seller, the seller himself admits that he was "in bed with the devil" so to speak (in that he was letting someone else process the orders for him, the seller has no idea how the phones were being obtained)..

[diamond1]

I thought I posted these links before, when I got my phone from dmilton
http://www.sprintusers.com/forum/sho...d.php?t=144983

http://www.insurancejournal.com/news...4/04/88853.htm

The second link (quoted below) shows that Asurion HAS been aware of scams like this in the past (April 0 and still has huge holes in their system as evidenced by this thread.

I personally spent two hours on the phone wish Asurion, trying to inform them of this scheme that dmilton is involved in, costing them likely $100k a month or more. They said it sounds like Sprint might be interested but Asurion's job is just to ship phones for sprint after verifying, they said it's sprints money so I'd have to report it to them. I spent another 90 minutes calling every dept at sprint who would listen to me, corporate security loss prevention etc. Eventually they said I'd have to send them an email to some controller/loss prevention dept--they wouldn't even speak to me about stopping a multi million dollar fraud case which has obviously happened to them before this.

Sprint is so negligent here, first by allowing access to private info such as phone numbers addresses and PINs, and also by not closing the gap after they were first burned by the scam mentioned in the article. Come on what would it really take them to fix it? A big warning letter shipped with asurion replacement phones stating it is fraud if you ordered this as a paid phone? A policy to NEVER allow drop ships to an address other than the customer address on record (or to a newly changed address), unless the credit card used for the insurance $50 payment matches a CCV/address verifification?

Eventually the sellers will move on to scam sprint for different model phones. why? asurion will start to get refurb'd diamonds in stock instead of the nicely packed retail boxes.

As for me, I got my refund from dmilton without sending the phone back to the seller (am I THAT stupid? ship it back to him so that he can resell it AND sprint still shows my address as the ship to on the fraudulent phone). I am waiting for sprint to contact me back to follow up, in the meantime I'm using the phone since I had already made arrangements to sell my old phone.

Nearly Dozen Arrested for $2 Million California Insurance Fraud Scam
April 4, 2008

"...Wireless phone dealers, employees and customers were arrested for their purported involvement in a $2 million insurance scam. the Department of Insurance said. "

"...insurance administrator Asurion Corp. (previously lock/line) reported suspected fraudulent claims. "

".... After selling a wireless phone to a customer, a store employee, associate, or owner will file a claim with the insurance company for a lost or stolen phone. After the insurance company sends a replacement cellular phone, the dealer sells or gives away the replacement phone free to a new customer. CDI said this scheme is often repeated on new wireless phone accounts, without the original customer's knowledge that an insurance claim was made on his or her account. CDI's said its investigation uncovered approximately $2 million worth of replacement wireless phones that were shipped out by Asurion as a result of this fraud scheme. This investigation continues, and CDI said it expects to make more arrests. "

[lexusgs]

Hey guys, Just wondering after reading so many forums, I cancelled my insurance about a year ago, so I shouldn't be billed for anything correct????

[robotphood]

So I received my phone today. It comes with the Asurion invoice/return slip. I don't have insurance on my account and never gave the seller any info. I'm doubting any guarantees Sprint or Asurion says of not being charged because you never know what will happen later on. But it is odd that you find info on the same scenario from up to a year ago. I don't understand why Sprint is just letting this go? They obviously know about it by now. Anyone actually have their phone deactivated by Sprint so far?

[diamond1]

Originally Posted by robotphood

So I received my phone today. It comes with the Asurion invoice/return slip. I don't have insurance on my account and never gave the seller any info.

Anyone buying the phone at a below market price, pretending not to notice the other sprint customer's telephone # on the asurion packing slip, etc is asking to have the phone eventually deactivated by Sprint. Buyers who either know this at the time of sale or learn of it when opening the box are in possession of stolen property, even though it's the ebay seller dmilton that is committing the theft by deception. Sadly I haven't seen any ebay sellers feedback list 'warning-fraudulently obtaining phones from sprint/asurion as insurance replacements'.

Sprint has the right to turn off every asurion obtained phone and demand them back with no compensation at any time. Clean ESN just menas it wasn't reported as stolen/fraud at the *time* the rep checked or activated it.

Sprint is definitely playing a blind eye to all this, apparently victim of their own size (a smaller company would have an executive on the phone seconds after someone calls and offers to save them from a scam currently occuring that's costing them millions of $$ a year, and if they were burned once they wouldn't allow themselves to be subject to a similar scam a year later).

Ebay sellers of new diamonds so far below market price seem to be in two categories: 1) next day shipping: those scamming asurion/sprint and drop shipping to their buyers directly 2) slower shipping: those scamming asurion/sprint and having them shipped to them first, allowing them to reship to the buyers without the pesky insurance fraud signs (asurion packing slip).

[robotphood]

Will Asurion let you know if a phone is from them? Even if the price is high this doesn't guarantee it's not. My phone was shipped from the seller's address but he/she left the return slip in the box. If they didn't leave it in and I didn't read this thread I would've been clueless. Harsh reality for us buyers

[reconboy]

O I can promise you I am keeping my phone because I still think I am going to get hit with a fee for not returning a defective phone to Asurion but the good thing is I have filed my dispute with Paypal , even included scanned images of the packaging.

I will get my money back from this guy one way or another (well hopefully anyways!) and I still may contact the Attorney General here in KY just to see if anything else can be done legally.

Just another insight , if you receive it from Louisville Kentucky that is a Warehouse for Sprint and Asurion, its right off Outer Loop if any of you are from around Louisville you will know where I am talking about.

Last thing is just protect yourself, with this issue you could possibly get stuck with paying twice for the phone plus 50.00 for the insurance if you are carrying the insurance with Sprint.

[bostonshaker]

Well, I was close to the paypal 45 day period in which to file a claim, so I figured I better do in case my phone gets shut off. The name of dmilton is Milton Dixon or Dixon Milton. At least that is what my transaction details say. When I bought from him, he had 100% positive feedback and since I have had over four hundred successful transaction, I am careful, but not to overly cautious since I use paypal for everything.

Saying that someone is just asking for trouble for buying a phone that is a good deal is just flat wrong. Not all good deals are suspect and the fact that Sprint is raping it's customers just gives them more reason to seek out a better deal.

In my opinion, the ones who are wrong are obviously dmilton. Sprint and Asurion are definately wholly at fault as well. This is obviously a scam involving personal information and Sprint or Asurion needs to keep it's employees on a tighter leash.

Jail will look good for dmilton.

Good luck all