Originally Posted by Tpimp420 (Post 1567472)

Ok I have to say it is getting heated in here with the Android/Winmo/Iphone advocates from each corner squaring off. I won't begin to bash other OS's because this thread is already getting off topic. I just want to clear up on some disagreements with what I said earlier.



Lol you are obviously in a bad mood today :angry7:! I see you have flamed almost every post today that says anything bad about windows phone 7. Is this really Steve Balmer? Are you posting from barcelona?? Dude give it a rest, I said If at the beginning of my last post. You don't have to get so upset!....

But you're right microsoft hasn't said much. But there is a lot of speculation and they also didn't clear up very much either.

By multi-tasking I mean I am surfing the web in Opera mobile 10, I find a page with flash in it that I can't watch in this browser. I copy the link of the page, click my Quickmenu (an application that isn't opera) icon, and select today, which brings me Home.My home screen is another application(or service one might call it) called Sense v2.5. From Sense I click on the shortcut to Skyfire. I then paste my link into the address bar and go watch the Flash video (Opera is still running in the background, as well as about 4 other apps).When I'm done watching the vid I go back and surf away in opera. Lol Just because I can!




Haha Like I said cranky today! For those of you that understand the technical underbelly of an OS. You can see where I might have expected some of these things. If you wanted to do some readying Tim

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Windows_Mobile

you would see that windows mobile has come a long way. Before the release of Windows Phone series 7. Us developers (i.e. me and the rest of the people writing software for winmo devices) expected Windows phone 7 to be built on WinCe 6. WinCe 6 was going to offer vast improvements to WinCe 5.2 (what winmo 5, and 6 are built on). Many of these improvements I stated in my previous post that you flamed.

More importantly there is a new rumor that Windows Phone 7 is actually built on a new and unreleased WinCe 7 (might be released at MIX) which should offer improvements to WinCe 6. So my expectations were very high. And as I am a potential application developer for WP7 this type of thing does concern me. And Microsoft needs to be aware that while, many users are just plain consumers who know very little about the hardware or software they are using (Like you Tim), there are also many users whom are extremely tech savvy and choose WinMo FOR THIS REASON! Even if I only was a consumer I have my right to dislike their product and UI.




As for the above quote, I don't really need to say much. You don't have to get so defensive Tim. I mean really if you knew anything about selling software you would understand it is a business just like any other. If a business partner you have been working with for sometime (say M$), suddenly stabs you in the back and changes all the business plans you made. You might be upset. I'm glad as a consumer you don't care about small things like the thousands of employees that develop UI's, games, and apps that just won't work on WinMo7. You just care about the end user experience right?

Also when you say done, and all the crap about bitching , and wait for MIX it makes me wonder if you read the other posts you flame because I've said this today...



That pretty much says, that some of my expectations came true, but mostly they sucked. Oh and I do believe I am waiting for MIX10 considering I have F-ING Tickets Dumbass.



No I wouldn't. Because it is not the hardware on the windows phone that was used to demo WP7 I didn't like (we don't even know the specs on the hardware), it was the software that sucked. Also, I don't think the touch pro 2 isn't capable of pushing those worthless transition animations. And again you're wrong, It is my open-minded self that thought of all the possibilities this device might have, that was so very disappointed when the reality settled in. Only time will tell if Windows Phone 7 will be worth the hype. However if it is as simple-minded as the iphone(which it resembles greatly), it is unfortunate for all winmo powers users (The Power Users Tim, not you and the mindless consumer that likes pretty colors. I hope this wasn't too much bitching for you Tim).

Also one last note Tim, though you have flamed many posts in this thread, and others. I didn't see any of these under your posts....

Originally Posted by smoove21 (Post 1568230)

Lol i was with him at first. I dont like when people get mad because their views are different from your own. I have no problem with him liking whichever os is out there but becoming negative because someone disagrees with you is childish. One question i really do need answered is.. what will happen to sites like this one and xda? No more flashing and cabs/free apps floating around?

Originally Posted by Malatesta (Post 1568104)

To expand/clarify:

I think the real locked down version is Pink/Turtle/Pure. See some specs and more info here posted today, which are new/not covered yet.

Next is a stripped down, business edition. We have not seen that yet, but read this article and note what HTC says: "Unique HTC experience". Serious question: what do you think that means? I think it refers to Sense or something analogous.

I think what we saw today was the "high end" full version. But I'm real curious as to what HTC has to say. More on that tomorrow.

Originally Posted by Malatesta (Post 1568104)

To expand/clarify:

I think the real locked down version is Pink/Turtle/Pure. See some specs and more info here posted today, which are new/not covered yet.

Next is a stripped down, business edition. We have not seen that yet, but read this article and note what HTC says: "Unique HTC experience". Serious question: what do you think that means? I think it refers to Sense or something analogous.

I think what we saw today was the "high end" full version. But I'm real curious as to what HTC has to say. More on that tomorrow.

Originally Posted by Noir (Post 1568336)

now I was under the assumption that what we saw today was the version sent to OEMs and their UI is placed on it which in hindsight doesn't make much sense. Okay that's for the clearup on that but considering the wp7 development do you think htc will show anything on wp7??? Beyond some teasers?

Originally Posted by nrfitchett4 (Post 1568564)

the way wmexperts podcast had it, was that this was going to be a really expensive "feature" phone. that there would be maybe 2 more variations of wm7. they went on to say why would WM block 3rd party UI's when the HD2 has coding for WM7 already built into sense. but it is all speculation at this point.

Originally Posted by Malatesta (Post 1568625)

I honestly don't know what HTC will do about WP7 :-/

All I know for 100% is this: we have NOT see everything yet

Now, what that actually translates too, I'm not sure either. That's just what I do know with certainty. That's why I think it's waaaay to early for people here to be "deciding" on what they think. Don't get me wrong: I understand 1st impressions, questions and concerns. But I'm just saying: there is more to come in the future. What and when, even I'm not sure.

lol, I know what was said because I said it :drunken: Hi, I'm the co-host of the WME podcast, please to meet you

As i said above, I know for a fact that what we say today wasn't everything. How Turtle/Pink (with their lower res screens, but still impressive offerings) fit in, what OEMs are going to do, etc. is still up in the air.

Either way, I like what I see so far. If groups like PPCG/XDA wane because of the lack of "hacking", so be it. It's better for the broader consumer base and general experience. But I don't think it'll be too bad either.

Originally Posted by Malatesta (Post 1568625)

I honestly don't know what HTC will do about WP7 :-/

All I know for 100% is this: we have NOT see everything yet

Now, what that actually translates too, I'm not sure either. That's just what I do know with certainty. That's why I think it's waaaay to early for people here to be "deciding" on what they think. Don't get me wrong: I understand 1st impressions, questions and concerns. But I'm just saying: there is more to come in the future. What and when, even I'm not sure.

lol, I know what was said because I said it :drunken: Hi, I'm the co-host of the WME podcast, please to meet you

As i said above, I know for a fact that what we say today wasn't everything. How Turtle/Pink (with their lower res screens, but still impressive offerings) fit in, what OEMs are going to do, etc. is still up in the air.

Either way, I like what I see so far. If groups like PPCG/XDA wane because of the lack of "hacking", so be it. It's better for the broader consumer base and general experience. But I don't think it'll be too bad either.

Originally Posted by bkrodgers (Post 1568544)

I haven't seen anything beyond speculation to indicate that a "legacy" or customizable version exists at all, other than HTC indicating that they're working to bring the "HTC experience" to WP7. That can mean ANYTHING...it could just mean they'll have some custom panels built in. I'm not saying it isn't happening, but I just am very doubtful. If you listen to Joe Belfiore's 20 minute video as well as some of Steve Ballmer's comments, it's clear that they are very interested in establishing the Windows Phone brand as something that means certain things. When asked about customization, his two examples were changing the background color of the tiles on the home page and changing from white on black text to black on white text. Maybe I'm reading too much into the examples he gave, but to me it sounds like this is how they want WP7 devices to operate. There may be customization, but I don't think they're going to allow the core user experience to be replaced, as was the case with TouchFlo/Sense.

As for this community and XDA, I give a lot of credit to everyone here, but I think we need to acknowledge a few things:

First, most of the chefs are assembling things from other devices' software, leaks, and applying a lot of registry edits. Many of those things may simply not exist to be included in custom WP7 ROMs. Yes, I'm sure there will be some hacking, just has there has been even with the iPhone. And the folks here will certainly surprise me. But the selection of "ingredients" at the "grocery store" may be a lot thinner than what we're used to.

Second, custom ROMs exist (at least out in the open) in no small part because Microsoft allows them to. They absolutely have the right to try to shut them down. Other than the fake guy who's tried to do that, there's no evidence Microsoft has given a crap. That's been part of their Windows Mobile strategy though -- deliver a platform and punt it to anyone who wants to license it with very little in the way of requirements or oversight. Allowing this community is consistent with that. But with the new vision of "taking more responsibility" for the user experience, they may frown on how easy this community makes it to change that experience. Whether they clamp down or how hard they do remains to be seen. But keep in mind, this is the same company that is about to roll out a feature in desktop Windows 7 that phones home every 90 days to see if your software is legal. Don't be surprised to see REAL takedown notices if they decide that's part of their "responsibility" for the user experience.

Originally Posted by nrfitchett4 (Post 1568564)

the way wmexperts podcast had it, was that this was going to be a really expensive "feature" phone. that there would be maybe 2 more variations of wm7. they went on to say why would WM block 3rd party UI's when the HD2 has coding for WM7 already built into sense. but it is all speculation at this point.

Originally Posted by smoove21 (Post 1568194)

I have no problem with what microsoft has done.[...] Their new os is great for them it just doesnt stand out when compared to other os', nothing is new or hasnt been done before.[...] Please if you agree/disagree comment. Be respectful because im not disrespecting anyone else's opinion.

Originally Posted by Malatesta (Post 1568625)

All I know for 100% is this: we have NOT see everything yet



As i said above, I know for a fact that what we say today wasn't everything. How Turtle/Pink (with their lower res screens, but still impressive offerings) fit in, what OEMs are going to do, etc. is still up in the air.

Originally Posted by gimme5 (Post 1568875)

Great post, Smoove!





By the way, there's no way it's gonna be called "Windows Phone 7 Series", right? "Series" is coming off, it'll be something like "Windows Phone 7 starter", "Windows Phone 7 Premium Media" or whatever.

Originally Posted by gimme5 (Post 1568875)

Great post, Smoove!

I don't know about not standing out compared to other UIs. I think the tiles being "alive" might make WP7 stand out a bit. If I walk into a store knowing nothing about phones and I see static screens everywhere except on one phone where things other than the wallpaper are moving, it might catch my eye. And if it's on the lock screen, it might give the (justified?) impression that WP7 is a more personal phone.
une Phone" or something like that?

Originally Posted by gcianc (Post 1568840)

laughable speculation.

"really expensive feature phone" is editors reaching for webhits.

Originally Posted by smoove21 (Post 1569697)

The reason why i say it doesn't and wouldn't stand out if i were in a store is because motorola's blur does the exact same thing. Actually it does it better.[...]I'm sure there's a way to turn those things off but if one does this then what happens? Does it become one of the same if not worse static screens you spoke of?

Originally Posted by Certs (Post 1570054)

I haven't had time to watch the video yet, but can anyone tell me if its true that this OS won't multitask 3rd party apps?

Originally Posted by Dr.8820 (Post 1570096)

i can't say that it's true, but that's what i keep reading. hopefully, that and flash will be added by the time it's actually released.

Originally Posted by Deimoss (Post 1570166)

So people coming off the Touch Pro after two years get to upgrade to a Windows 7 Series Device, that is beyond awesome, Here's hoping Sprint nails a nice 7 device for launch and make it worth!!

Got a stack of cash burning a whole in my pocket till holidays 2010

Originally Posted by gimme5 (Post 1569887)

Last thing: I like how, no matter how you cut my post, you make sure to include "Great post, Smoove!" in the quote ;)

Originally Posted by Deimoss (Post 1570166)

So people coming off the Touch Pro after two years get to upgrade to a Windows 7 Series Device, that is beyond awesome, Here's hoping Sprint nails a nice 7 device for launch and make it worth!!

Got a stack of cash burning a whole in my pocket till holidays 2010

Originally Posted by Malatesta (Post 1569832)

Actually, I never said WP7 would be a "really expensive feature phone" but said that Pink/Turtle/Pure were high end feature phones and what we see at MWC would be the "true" WP7 smartphones. So far I think that is 100% correct.

And I take offense at the "reaching for webhits" bit. We clearly differentiate rumor from fact on our site and don't drag posts out to get repeat hits.

Originally Posted by Deimoss (Post 1570166)

So people coming off the Touch Pro after two years get to upgrade to a Windows 7 Series Device, that is beyond awesome, Here's hoping Sprint nails a nice 7 device for launch and make it worth!!

Got a stack of cash burning a whole in my pocket till holidays 2010

Originally Posted by gcianc (Post 1568840)

laughable speculation.

iPhone (best performing one that does everything in iPhone ecosystem) is $199 and where phones are in 2010.

"really expensive feature phone" is editors reaching for webhits.

Originally Posted by VW (Post 1570251)

I imagine this Microsoft device will require a simply everything plan ... Grrr

I thought it looked pretty nice, although I wasnt a fan of the blue tiles. Do something dynamic with those as well. Also throw in Bing Turn By Turn navigation ala Android, multitasking and some backwards compatibility. Ill buy.

Zune Software is greeeaatt..much better than iTunes. Wireless sync for podcasts is the bees-knees.

Having said that... (A little off topic) Android on Sprint sucks. When is HTC or another manu going to release a decent Android phone on Sprint?

Originally Posted by gcianc (Post 1570830)

Pink is without a doubt a teen/tween phone series (somewhat based on a the new wm7 kernel that won't run wm7 apps obviously due to hardware and marketing limitations) that WILL no doubt be popular if properly MARKETED. Especially since carriers (USA) force $20/mo or $30/mo data plans on any phone with more than 0-9, send/stop keys. Tweens don't want old-man blackberries or super(geek)phones (droid/wm6). They text like mo'fos 24/7 and dabble in facebook while listening to free mp3s and playing games. They don't post on forums either. They can do with probably 90 minutes a month too.

Originally Posted by gcianc (Post 1570830)

sorry but letting the msmobiles clowns - UNEDITED - post on your front page is ample proof.

you can do better. much, much, much better. ;)

Pink is without a doubt a teen/tween phone series (somewhat based on a the new wm7 kernel that won't run wm7 apps obviously due to hardware and marketing limitations) that WILL no doubt be popular if properly MARKETED. Especially since carriers (USA) force $20/mo or $30/mo data plans on any phone with more than 0-9, send/stop keys. Tweens don't want old-man blackberries or super(geek)phones (droid/wm6). They text like mo'fos 24/7 and dabble in facebook while listening to free mp3s and playing games. They don't post on forums either. They can do with probably 90 minutes a month too.

A couple of days ago you guys posted a roadmap of rumors and keep citing some code where HTC will disable WP7 for Sense. THAT'S NOT HAPPENING. Talking about separate ZUNE phones, Media & business editions (come on did anyone really think zune services/store would be omitted from wp7.. it's their frikin' bridge to media revenue along with games now that phones can handle the graphics). Re-read this
http://wmpoweruser.com/?p=12261

I just don't get how out of touch you can be with what is happening unless it's milking web traffic. Sorry.

Originally Posted by Tiberius85 (Post 1570992)

I dont care how little customization WP7 has. If the sluggishness and behavior of my TP2 makes me want to smash it against the wall, it needs to be fixed. If lack of customization is the key to a unified UX, so be it. I love my Zune HD and wish everyday since I bought it that it was my phone.

Originally Posted by brownhornet (Post 1571484)

Guess you didnt notice that there is STILL lag in the video

Originally Posted by Noir (Post 1571454)

oh yes it is
http://pocketnow.com/news-archive/ht...-book-touch-ui
This ui made no sense to me prior to watching the wp7s presentation. Now it does! And I am completely sure this will be the next UI for wpseries smartphones. It took me a long time to find this

Originally Posted by gcianc (Post 1571546)

no disrespect to HTC - they make good, not great phones - but they are a HARDWARE maker not a software difference maker. Their software initiative has hit a dead end.

Their software is already LOCKED OUT OF iPhone, blackberry and soon now Windows 7 Phone.

What's left?

Hooo-rah!

It doesn't take a rocket scientist to see they'll be paiting themselves into a small corner... limiting the HTC Experience to non-smart HTC "feature phones" and htc-branded android devices within 9 months. That is pretty steep odds working against them for a major software initiative with no chance of "marketplace" revenue.

And you all know the "pink" stuff is essentially zune feature phone so once WP7 ships microsoft can easily leverage that market too - against HTC.