How is the TP2 faster that the TP?

[Zeybrin]

Originally Posted by buddhatikkigod

500mhz on different cpus can be entirely different. Compare a 500mhz P2/p3/ or celeron to a 500mhz Core Duo/Solo

500 mhz core duo/solo?

is this guy serious? for one a core duo has two cores. . . so of course its going to be faster... and 2 i was just simply stating that 500 mhz is going to be the same between similar processors without a bunch of things to make them faster like pipe lining or hyper threading. . . of course processors that are radically more advanced are going to be faster.

[hamidxa]

Originally Posted by Zeybrin

okay. . . you list all of this detailed information about the cpu. . . but even the fastest cpu's will run like a pentium 1 without the right RAM. . .

just because it has the same amount of ram as the touch pro 1. . . doesnt mean its the same speed. . . or maybe the system clock ticks faster? making quick changes more possible. . . or even just faster bus speeds. . .

the processor may be older, but 500 mhz is 500 mhz, is 500 mhz (not the exact number but you get the point) maybe the only reason they are using an older processor is because they have more room for a larger one. . .

cpu has very little to do with speed when compared to the quality of the RAM.

Sorry to burst your bubble here, but RAM does NOT, i repeat, RAM DOES NOT make *THAT* much of a difference.

For example, the difference between DDR2@800 MHz versus DDR3@800 MHz is about 1-2% in real world scenarios, and naturally, that would include a faster bus speed as well.

I haven't read the rest of this thread yet beyond this post (about to read up on it now), but this gave me pause as you are spreading about misinformation.

Don't mean to come off sounding rude, but RAM and bus speed alone can NOT make that big of a difference, especially when the RAM is virtually the same, and the system bus by many accounts is nominally tweaked.

Drivers on the other hand CAN make the difference, and in this regard, the OP is on the money.
Unfortunately however, he was also correct in pointing out that HTC is unwilling to fork over the extra buck and some change to pay Qualcomm for the appropriate 3D drivers (and/or chipset) to accompany their phones over the past several generations.

I am reluctant to believe that HTC has changed their ways, but would love to read otherwise.

[BlaqMogul]

Originally Posted by hamidxa

Sorry to burst your bubble here, but RAM does NOT, i repeat, RAM DOES NOT make *THAT* much of a difference.

For example, the difference between DDR2@800 MHz versus DDR3@800 MHz is about 1-2% in real world scenarios, and naturally, that would include a faster bus speed as well.

I haven't read the rest of this thread yet beyond this post (about to read up on it now), but this gave me pause as you are spreading about misinformation.

Don't mean to come off sounding rude, but RAM and bus speed alone can NOT make that big of a difference, especially when the RAM is virtually the same, and the system bus by many accounts is nominally tweaked.

Drivers on the other hand CAN make the difference, and in this regard, the OP is on the money.
Unfortunately however, he was also correct in pointing out that HTC is unwilling to fork over the extra buck and some change to pay Qualcomm for the appropriate 3D drivers (and/or chipset) to accompany their phones over the past several generations.

I am reluctant to believe that HTC has changed their ways, but would love to read otherwise.

Im just waiting for the Nvidia Tegra chip to come out for mobiles phons.....i doubt that HTC will invest the money in that though

[akayareal]

This is very important to me to seeing how im not even up for a $75 upgrade. I'll be buying the phone upfront and don't want to feel like i wasted my money when i could have just kept my tp.

For this reason i will wait a few weeks before i make the leap and see what other former tp users have to say about it.

Originally Posted by akayareal

For this reason i will wait a few weeks before i make the leap and see what other former tp users have to say about it.

Smart move! I WISH I could be this disciplined. To me though, the speed isn't what gets me randy, it's the screen size/resolution. The speed on the TP IMHO is decent. Now battery life, that certainly could use some improvement. But either way, I'll be buying Day 1. No need for me to wait and see what others have to say. The size of the screen is a VAST improvement.

[nitussi]

Yeah, all HTC phones seem to have the same 528mhz processor in them, which I feel is behind the time for the TP2. It should of had atleast an omap 3430 that way we could get decent video playback on that beautiful screen. I'm actually thinking about holding off on the TP2 and getting the samsung omnia pro b7610--which has an 800mhz processor and windows mobile.. keyboard just isnt as nice tho and sprint may not get it.

[gTen]

It is not only missing 3d acceleration, but 2d drivers as well...its like having a dual core computer and not using one of the cores at all.

[Exil3d]

Originally Posted by Young_breedent

I disagree completely. Have you actually played with the TP2??? Well i have and the overall experience on the device is better, not just TF3D. I don't know what they did to make the screen more sensitive, and the device run faster but it's definitely an improvement over the original TP. SO for those of you who just use the regular windows mobile home screen you will still see the improvements. Also the battery life is better, the speakers are waaaayyy better, the keyboard is waaayyyy better, the screen is waaayyyy better, and you don't have those heat issues. I was never disappointed with the speed of my touch pro just other things. So for them to make it faster with all the other improvements is definitely worth the upgrade

You are missing the point. 3d accelaration does not exisat on the phone. TF3D feels snappier cuz its been rewritten to a moree optimized performance. Everything else will feel the same. Look at the vids.. look at all the vids and judge it yourself. I think you have a bias opinion and you wWANT it to be better but I dont blame you.I wish it was better.. but I wont fall sucker to the whole 3d Drivewr fiasco.

Originally Posted by nitussi

Yeah, all HTC phones seem to have the same 528mhz processor in them, which I feel is behind the time for the TP2. It should of had atleast an omap 3430 that way we could get decent video playback on that beautiful screen. I'm actually thinking about holding off on the TP2 and getting the samsung omnia pro b7610--which has an 800mhz processor and windows mobile.. keyboard just isnt as nice tho and sprint may not get it.

Yup, a step backwards. At least since HTC puts in a older CPU for gods sake give us 3d accelaration!

Originally Posted by gTen

It is not only missing 3d acceleration, but 2d drivers as well...its like having a dual core computer and not using one of the cores at all.

Yup even those are terrible. They are a bit better but nothi9ng to jump in joy about. Again.. all the people who really want to see how different and better the Pro 2 is just go youtube the Pro 2 videos and see for yourself. Trust me.. I want to get one but I ahave seen pretty much all the vids out there and one thing i saw in common was jow similar 2d and specialy 3d was being rendered. The last nail in the coffin for me was when I saw TOm TOm run at 4 FPS. LOL! thatw as enough for me. Only way I will get the PRO 2 is if they give it for free.

[Deggree]

Originally Posted by Exil3d

You are missing the point. 3d accelaration does not exisat on the phone. TF3D feels snappier cuz its been rewritten to a moree optimized performance. Everything else will feel the same. Look at the vids.. look at all the vids and judge it yourself. I think you have a bias opinion and you wWANT it to be better but I dont blame you.I wish it was better.. but I wont fall sucker to the whole 3d Drivewr fiasco.

Yup, a step backwards. At least since HTC puts in a older CPU for gods sake give us 3d accelaration!



Yup even those are terrible. They are a bit better but nothi9ng to jump in joy about. Again.. all the people who really want to see how different and better the Pro 2 is just go youtube the Pro 2 videos and see for yourself. Trust me.. I want to get one but I ahave seen pretty much all the vids out there and one thing i saw in common was jow similar 2d and specialy 3d was being rendered. The last nail in the coffin for me was when I saw TOm TOm run at 4 FPS. LOL! thatw as enough for me. Only way I will get the PRO 2 is if they give it for free.

Ok here's my thing I understand what ur saying about the Drivers and acceleration and u seem to know what ur talking about in that reguard. BUT, your reasoning is Sooooo flawed. for one, the vast majority (not all) of the YOUTUBE video's showcasing the TP2 are not final product versions. I saw one guy say he wasn't getting it cuz the phone didn't come with anything other than the charger and he posted a youtube link with an unboxing vid. In the video the guy never ONCE said he PURCHASED his device. My point is, with these reviews it's just that, a review. Alot of those phones are not in final stages. Now b4 I get bashed obviously there are some vid's of retail TP2's like for T-Mobile and Tel. I personally went into a T-Mobile store the day the device was realeased and gave it a good 3 hour run. My initial thoughts we're ****ing wow good job HTC. In your case your trying to tell people that a phone they have proven to perform better than the TP is still not a better phone due to something it's laking hardware wise. Problem is the original TP didn't have these components either, which in that case the only basis of comparison u have is what the phones DO have not what they DON'T! That bein said, if the TP2 is optimized for TF3D and it runs smoother and more stable then yes in the hands and minds of the consumer it is in fact a BETTER/UPGRADED experience. In conclusion I think that it's injust to try to convince people that the TP2 is NOT a better device due to lack of components but more appropriate to state your disregaurd for the device due to the fact that it lacks ceartain elements that you feel would make it an even BETTER Device/Experience than it already is. No one is perfect no thing is perfect if the phone had all the drivers and accelerators and processors u mentioned I'm sure u could still find something wrong with it. Bottom line is people are satisfied with the changes that have been made if your not it's cool but let us love our upgrade in peace LOL.

[jessiethe3rd]

Having both... having used both, quite extensively as a power user, there is no question... no ifs, no ands, no buts... the TP2 is a superior device. You can argue many points that the TP2 is just not that much of an upgrade and on paper you may be right. From an experience perspective, however, the TP2 is just all around better. Screen resolution, screen sensitivity, speed, battery life, and even hardware ports (3.5mm headphone jack...) this device is just more useable for every day.

Areas I have seen a difference:

Web browsing - there is no comparison - the screen on the TP2 enabled me to check sites with relative ease.

Nav - the larger screen makes it easy to use a it as a navigation device. I have the updated drivers and I use Garmin XT - it works like a dream (can't speak for Tomtom or iGo

Landscape is really landscape - quite honestly, when I switch to landscape I get a real landscape feel - I usually to opt to run the unit in landscape anytime I get into my car and it performs fantastic

OEM vs OEM speed - out of the box the TP2 is just faster and smoother - don't ask me why - I do not know - it just is. Just this can be overcome with some tools / custom ROMs for the TP but truth is in the pudding here on speed and the TP2 wins

Touchflo 2.1 and beyond, the way it was meant to be - I'm back on the screen again but the space on a TP feel cramped and way out of place with a TP 2.1 ROM... a TP 2.5 ROM looks even more dorky... there just isn't enough space on the screen to get things done. Segments are cut off where they shouldn't be - the TP 2.1+ experience is obviously optimized for a 800x480 screen.

Productivity - again... more space = more room to view and use. I can type out an email and have enough space on the screen to not have to either a.) put the font down to small or b.) make the font large enough to see but get like 5 works on the screen per line. 640x480 on a smaller screen is just not good enough IMHO.

Keyboard - not even in the same realm. The keys are spaced out naturally. The device begs for you to use the keyboard - so simple, so clean, so... well just RIGHT. With the TP the keys felt smashed together (albeit you can type on the TP) you just don't get the same experience

Onscreen keyboard - back to the screen AGAIN - bigger screen = larger onscreen keyboard... I can now use the onscreen keyboard and have space to actually SEE what's going on versus get the sliver of space I was getting with the TP

Speaker phone - I cannot express how nice it is to be on the phone - put it face down and you have a GRADE A speaker phone. Not a tin can but a SPEAKER PHONE with noise reduction. There is absolutely no comparison - it just sounds better

Speakers in general - in the morning you'll catch me singing in the shower... why? Well because all my Zune subscription content is synched with my TP2 and the speaker on the phone actually sounds OKAY for music. Yes, I know, not the booming house system but it is PERFECT for a quick listen! It works well and I can actually hear a bit of bass in the music (I kid you not.) NO it's not BASS that makes the house quake but it is bass none the less.

Sensor - unit goes to my face... screen goes off... unit comes off my face.... screen comes on... so easy... so necessary...

These are just some of the reasons why the TP2 is a worthy upgrade. It made sense for me and I will never go back (I sold my TP yesterday for that matter lol.)