Does "my location" work for anyone on the new google maps

[sheureka]

What's goofy is I downloaded it to my Samsung M610 - the GPS on it has been amazingly accurate with Garmin Mobile, Live Search, InfoSpace and TeleNav - and the Google app says it isn't implemented for GPS. It did, however, identify my phone when I installed it. Weird. - sheureka

[timothydonohue]

yeah, i got a 'temporarily unavailable' message when i tried it. however, there were new options in this version of G maps though...

[TC1]

Originally Posted by Malatesta

I was under the distinct impression that this is cellular triangulation, which is very different than aGPS (it is far less accurate).

This is the same issue with Windows Live Search and Sprint: triangulation, not aGPS.

Malatesta, aGPS is cellular triangulation... I'll do a quick explanation here (I'm sure I've typed this a million places elsewhere, lol):

aGPS stands for assisted GPS... aGPS in many ways is actually better than stand alone GPS because the device (cell phone) doesn't have to find/receive the GPS signal from the over-head satellites. It takes additional power to receive the sat signals as opposed to just receiving the cellular network signal, thus cutting into your phone's battery life.

How does aGPS work? What it does is let the carrier's network do the computational intensive triangulation measurements (which also saves phone power).

How does this happen? Every cell tower has it's own stand-alone GPS receiver, that way every cell tower knows its own location, this will become important in a second. On the carrier's network there are computers known as Assistance Servers, these are the devices that do the actual triangulation computations. Emergency response organizations (ie, 911) have access to these servers, as do the phones themselves (as long as they are unlocked).

The details: either the cell phone or emergency services can start a query with an assistance server, the assistance server will then go out on the network and query all the cellular towers in your general area with a request such as "Hey, do any of you towers have a cell signal level for cell phone #123456?" If a tower detects the cell phone's signal it'll respond with the tower's (precise) lattitude and longitude location and the cell phone signal level. The assistance server will collect all the cell phone signal levels relative to each tower's location and then do the triangulation computation. It'll return the computed lat and long measurement back to the original requester (the cell phone or the 911 network computers).

By accessing the aGPS API for the chip in the phone, that's how a program like mGMAPS makes a phone like my wife's LG Fusic GPS capable... even though it has no stand-alone GPS capability. This is also how carrier's LBS (location based services) work on phones that aren't full blown PDAs with stand-alone GPS, etc. That's why Sprint wanted to shutdown the author of mGMAPS... he was basically giving folks for free capabilities that the carriers normally charge extra $$$ for.

Hope this explanation was clear and helpful

-TC

[Kasracer]

aGPS does some cellular triangulation to get a rough idea where someone is and to help the GPS device using aGPS to lock onto a GPS satellite.

This does not mean that the new Google feature is using aGPS in a traditional sense. Typically aGPS is only used when a GPS device can use it (it is, after all, meant to assist a GPS device and not be a stand alone device or service).

Since Google's and Microsft's Live services both have this feature, I very much doubt that they are using Sprint's (or any other carrier's) Assistance Server mainly due to the fact that some of the services, like Microsoft's, never required any updates on the device itself (as far as I know; I never tried it). Besides, if an API was either non existant or locked out that Google was using, I'd imagine you would get an error message or Google would handle the error properly and tell you it's not supported.

Of course I could be mistaken as to how Google is implementing this feature but you very rarely see any aGPS used without a real GPS unit as it was designed to help the GPS unit lock onto a satelite (by definition, you may never see aGPS used as a stand alone function but see something very similar that uses triangulation).

[TC1]

Kasracer , I have to respectfully disagree with your explanation. aGPS stands for assisted GPS... it doesn't mean that it's meant to assist a stand-alone GPS device, ie, one that derives all it's information primarily from the overhead satellites. A stand-alone GPS device doesn't need help... think about it. The OEM GPS system in my car never needs help locating a satellite. The stand-alone GPS receivers that you buy for your car (Tom-Tom) never need assistance. Even the small key chain models available don't need assistance. Either there is a signal or there is not.

Now, if a device is both GPS and aGPS capable, that just means if it can't see the sats, then it will use the cellular network to get its lat and long info. One has nothing to do with the other. That's why a flip phone with no standalone GPS capabilites can get location based services via aGPS. GPS and aGPS on a phone are distinct capabilities that have nothing to do with each other, other than the fact that a device may be capable of both and use each one as needed.

[timothydonohue]

i still want to know why i keep getting
"your current location is temporarily unavailable"

unless it is just shprints way of messing with me...

[timothydonohue]

bleh, nevermind, it won't work on the mogul ....yet. from a post on brighthand..

Sprint Promises Significant Upgrade for the HTC Mogul
Sprint is planning to introduce a system software update for the HTC Mogul that will bring new features to this smartphone, including faster wireless networking and new navigation capabilities.
In a post on the company's customer support forum, a member of the Sprint Product Development group said that new system software to be released early next year will upgrade this device to EV-DO Rev. A. The Mogul can already connect to Sprint's EV-DO network for high-speed wireless access, but Rev. A is faster than the version of EV-DO currently offered by this model.
In addition, this upgrade will fix an odd limitation in this smartphone. It ships with GRS hardware, but as it stands now there's no software driver to allow users to take advantage of it. The new system will change this, and the Mogul will then offer ful GPS capabilities.
The stament from Sprint doesn't give an exact release date for the sysem software upgrade, only saying it will be available in "early 1Q 2008".
Problems with the Last Update
This upcoming upgrade wn't be the first software update introduced for the Mogul. Sprint and HTC released an update last month. However, this has some bugs, and a needs t be replace.

Sprint and HTC regret any inconvenience customers have recently experienced with the Mogul. HTC is working on a new version of the software ROM for the Mogul which incorporates enhancements for Bluetooth performance and corrects issues that were unintentionally created by ROM version 2.16.651.0 (posted on HTC's website on October 24). Both Sprint and HTC have begun testing the new software and are targeting to make it available for download by the end of November.

In the mean time, people who have already installed ROM version 2.16 and are having problems can downgrade to the previous version, which can be found on HTC's web site.

Related Articles:

• HTC Mogul (Sprint PPC-6800) Review

[Kasracer]

Originally Posted by TC1

Kasracer , I have to respectfully disagree with your explanation. aGPS stands for assisted GPS... it doesn't mean that it's meant to assist a stand-alone GPS device

What? do you know the definition of assisted? it's meant to assist other GPS chipsets/devices.... your integrated GPS as well as an external GPS tool can both take advantage of aGPS (though, of course, this always depends on the implementation).

Originally Posted by TC1

Now, if a device is both GPS and aGPS capable, that just means if it can't see the sats, then it will use the cellular network to get its lat and long info. One has nothing to do with the other. That's why a flip phone with no standalone GPS capabilites can get location based services via aGPS. GPS and aGPS on a phone are distinct capabilities that have nothing to do with each other, other than the fact that a device may be capable of both and use each one as needed.

This isn't true on most phones. aGPS assists GPS to find a satelite to lock onto. it doesn't just magically replace it if it can't connect with a "rough" location.

Look it up in Wikipedia

[TC1]

Originally Posted by Kasracer

What? do you know the definition of assisted? it's meant to assist other GPS chipsets/devices.... your integrated GPS as well as an external GPS tool can both take advantage of aGPS (though, of course, this always depends on the implementation).
This isn't true on most phones. aGPS assists GPS to find a satelite to lock onto. it doesn't just magically replace it if it can't connect with a "rough" location.

Look it up in Wikipedia

Again, I'm going to have to disagree. All because something is on Wikipedia doesn't mean it's accurate. I'm a BSEE with over 25 years of digital chip, computer, software, and network design. I've talked to developers trying to crack the Sprint GPS issues.

You might get a better understanding of how aGPS works if you look at the mGMAPS web site. Look how the author there wrote the app, and for Sprint phones he specifically says "The QJAE GPS API (Sprint) was updated to prefer assisted-GPS over standalone GPS. This sacrifices accuracy for quicker fixes and more stable GPS positioning." Meaning that, yea, the application magically (as you put it) switches over to the aGPS system to get the lat and long coordinates if the stand-alone GPS receiver can't supply them.

Let's just leave it at we agree to disagree.

[crowssong]

Originally Posted by TC1

Again, I'm going to have to disagree. All because something is on Wikipedia doesn't mean it's accurate. I'm a BSEE with over 25 years of digital chip, computer, software, and network design. I've talked to developers trying to crack the Sprint GPS issues.

You might get a better understanding of how aGPS works if you look at the mGMAPS web site. Look how the author there wrote the app, and for Sprint phones he specifically says "The QJAE GPS API (Sprint) was updated to prefer assisted-GPS over standalone GPS. This sacrifices accuracy for quicker fixes and more stable GPS positioning." Meaning that, yea, the application magically (as you put it) switches over to the aGPS system to get the lat and long coordinates if the stand-alone GPS receiver can't supply them.

Let's just leave it at we agree to disagree.

And just because one self-proclaimed expert says something doesn't mean he's accurate either.

aGPS may use triangulation as part of its data sources, but that doesn't mean that all triangulation (or more accurately trilateration) methods = aGPS. What Google is using for this system is not requiring any use of any aGPS chipset. The program only needs the phone to pass on some tower information. Which means that it isn't requiring any intervention on the part of the assistance server for it to function. Which would be why Google is able to offer this service without getting permission from Sprint, Verizon, AT&T, etc.

If you don't trust Wikipedia, then maybe another article might educate you better.

http://www.gpsworld.com/gpsworld/art...l.jsp?id=12287