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  #11 (permalink)  
Old 11-11-2007, 09:39 AM
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Why would it be impossible for one to physically upgrade the RAM inside of their Mogul so that it is equal to the RAM in the Touch?

Is RAM in WM devices that hardwired to the phone that it's impossible to open the phone up and put in extra RAM? The physical RAM amount in the Touch can't be that much bigger then the physical RAM amount inside of the Mogul.
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Old 11-11-2007, 11:34 AM
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Originally Posted by neilson View Post
Why would it be impossible for one to physically upgrade the RAM inside of their Mogul so that it is equal to the RAM in the Touch?

Is RAM in WM devices that hardwired to the phone that it's impossible to open the phone up and put in extra RAM? The physical RAM amount in the Touch can't be that much bigger then the physical RAM amount inside of the Mogul.
I'm sure it's POSSIBLE, but you'd have to be someone skilled with circuit boards, then FIND the bigger RAM, and replace it. This isn't something the average Joe can do.
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  #13 (permalink)  
Old 11-11-2007, 12:32 PM
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If this is true, and the "touch" is in fact the "6900", than that is just a bad scar on a good name. The touch is a pda phone for the masses, and in my opinion is not worthy of that name or that series. My prediction is many will flock to the touch and be disappointed, especially for those that have never had a pda phone and think there getting an iphone alternative.

Last edited by PropagandaX; 11-11-2007 at 06:12 PM.
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Old 11-11-2007, 12:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Cicatrize View Post
I'm sure it's POSSIBLE, but you'd have to be someone skilled with circuit boards, then FIND the bigger RAM, and replace it. This isn't something the average Joe can do.
I just picture the RAM in the Touch as being equal or close to equal to the same size and shape as what's inside of the Mogul. IF we can find someone skilled and trained enough to do "swap outs" of RAM into Moguls, then that would be awesome. I call it interesting to look and see.
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Old 11-11-2007, 03:06 PM
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noo

well sprint better come out with a look alike mogul upgrade in less than a year cuz i really dont like the touch since it doesnt have a hardware keyboard and no wifi....why couldnt they cll it the "TOUCH"........now they ruined the name for the successor of the mogul,.....and i dont consider the touch as the successor of the mogul
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  #16 (permalink)  
Old 11-11-2007, 03:22 PM
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Originally Posted by neilson View Post
I just picture the RAM in the Touch as being equal or close to equal to the same size and shape as what's inside of the Mogul. IF we can find someone skilled and trained enough to do "swap outs" of RAM into Moguls, then that would be awesome. I call it interesting to look and see.
This is making a large assumption. The first assumption is that you're using a similar address bus on the Mogul as the Touch. While they do use the same chipset, and therefore you'd expect the same bus width, it doesn't mean that all the wires for the address bus are present on the Mogul.

Take for instance the fact that 64MB of RAM doesn't require an address bus larger than 24 bits, assuming that you have a 4-word-addressable memory. Addressing 128MB of RAM consequently requires 25 bits in our 4-word scheme. Why would they add the extra PCB traces to accommodate, say, the full 32-bit address bus, if the memory installed will never be more than what the factory intended? So add either 24 or 25 traces for the address bus, and you've saved realestate on a small embedded device platform.

The above doesn't imply that the address bus doesn't have the full 32 bits available, but it is nonetheless an assumption, and may be problematic.

The second assumption is that memory timing and latency is the same. It may be, and if it is standard SDRAM, a slower timing will work just fine on faster, newer memory. But what if the power requirements are different? It's well-known that more RAM means a bigger drain. This is because of CMOS leakage current within the device. The more gates/transistors you have, the more current leakage you are going to have. (SDRAM uses capacitive memory, but it still must be switched. Also, given that it is capacitive memory, it takes more power to recharge the RAM cells than if you had fewer of them, as in 128MB vs 64MB.) A way around this is to change your operating device characteristics. Build a lower-voltage device circuit, and change your device characteristics (transistor size, gate width, etc.) so that your leakage isn't as bad. If the power supply to the memory is different, then there is essentially no chance that you will see a RAM upgrade, especially not from the Touch.

These are just some points - simply moving a chip because the dimensions match says nothing about their interoperability. It'd be NICE, but keep in mind that embedded devices aren't as standardized as PC memory, where the end-user is actually responsible for their own memory upgrades (usually anyway.) Therefore, it makes it a lot more difficult, in the long run, to make embedded device parts interchangeable, and leaves us SOL because the manufacturer chose one part over another.

Last edited by APOLAUF; 11-11-2007 at 03:25 PM.
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  #17 (permalink)  
Old 11-11-2007, 03:32 PM
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Originally Posted by EtherealRemnant View Post
I *REALLY* wish people would get their facts straight.

HTC was working on the Touch BEFORE Apple launched the iPhone... its not meant to be an iPhone competitor and it never was.

Also, the 6900 IS the Touch. The Touch is also a huge upgrade from the Mogul, even WITHOUT the hardware keyboard. I won't go into the details here but the hardware inside is much better, its slimmer, faster, and it has a better screen to boot.
before apple *launched* the iphone, but do you really think htc had no idea apple was working on it?
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  #18 (permalink)  
Old 11-11-2007, 04:43 PM
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Originally Posted by APOLAUF View Post
This is making a large assumption. The first assumption is that you're using a similar address bus on the Mogul as the Touch. While they do use the same chipset, and therefore you'd expect the same bus width, it doesn't mean that all the wires for the address bus are present on the Mogul.

(edit)

These are just some points - simply moving a chip because the dimensions match says nothing about their interoperability. It'd be NICE, but keep in mind that embedded devices aren't as standardized as PC memory, where the end-user is actually responsible for their own memory upgrades (usually anyway.) Therefore, it makes it a lot more difficult, in the long run, to make embedded device parts interchangeable, and leaves us SOL because the manufacturer chose one part over another.
Nice write up, I wouldn't have had the patience. Are you an EE APOLAUF? In a former life I use to design integrated circuits (PMOS, NMOS, and CMOS) and do digital hardware design.
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  #19 (permalink)  
Old 11-11-2007, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by erick10 View Post
never noticed that the touch was the 6900.........but it aint the successor of the mogul right?i really dont like the touch as the succesor.........i would like somthin with a qwerty keyboard........not a toch screen keyboard
If a keyboard is all you need to define it as a successor, isn't the touch dual (or something like that) coming out next year which has the keyboard?
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  #20 (permalink)  
Old 11-11-2007, 05:41 PM
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Originally Posted by EtherealRemnant View Post
I *REALLY* wish people would get their facts straight.

HTC was working on the Touch BEFORE Apple launched the iPhone... its not meant to be an iPhone competitor and it never was.

Also, the 6900 IS the Touch. The Touch is also a huge upgrade from the Mogul, even WITHOUT the hardware keyboard. I won't go into the details here but the hardware inside is much better, its slimmer, faster, and it has a better screen to boot.
but wasn't the iphone being worked on before the touch was ever thought up? therefore wouldn't it constitute it being an iphone competitor?
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