Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Here we go again...

http://www.engadget.com/2010/03/02/a...phone-patents/

My 2 cents ...

Jobs and Fruit team see a viable threat as they did with Nokia and are trying to stifle the competition's resources with litigation to prevent release of devices... we'll see where this goes. According to industry insiders there is a number of possible countersuits by HTC. However in the end, consumers lose as these lawsuits can potentailly suspend devices from being released to the public until litigation is settled.

Anyone else heated up about this?

-skplex

(Oh and sorry if I posted this in the wrong forum, but I didn't see a general HTC forum)

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

wow...anyone else smelling the road to monopoly?!?! reminds of of those times about 10 years ago when microsoft sued everyone just for breathing. one of the complaint is that htc stole the multi-touch feature which apple has patented. so now, even if other manufacturers create a multi-touch program for mobile devices, apple will swoop down on them and say their patent was stolen? let's look at it this way. if the maker patented james bond, that means that no spy movies/stories could be made (bye bye mission impossible and mr bourne).

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Correct the customer does loose out but if HTC is stealing patents then apple does have a right to complain. Wouldn't you complain if it was your company getting your patents stolen or would you say steal my patents and my customers? I don't understand your point op.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

i agree with you p-slim about us as consumers are ultimately to losers in these things. but what i don't get is why was the patent approved? i would understand if they copyrighted the thing. but getting it patent basically means that nobody can create/write a similar product. doesn't having a patent mean that now only apple can be the only device that can have the multi-touch feature on phones?

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Why only HTC? Samsung moment and Motorola Droid have multi touch? Maybe theirs is coming. I'll be honest, the music player on the hd2 does resemble the itouch.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

maybe jobs is worried that each year there are better phones coming out that is leaving th iphone in the dust. and he must now collect his company's losses by trying to get royalty fees.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

@p-slim

I agree that if there is a legitimate patent dispute that "team fruit" (obviously I am indeed biased against Apple) has every right to proceed. However, I do find it to be quite "suspect" as to the timing of these lawsuits. Although news has not been released as to the details of all the infringements; I am assuming one of the key ones will be multitouch. HTC has been releasing multitouch devices for quite some time now; why is the lawsuit coming at the same time when HTC is about to release an onslaught of devices? Then again it could just be coincidence or perhaps they finally got everything in order for the lawsuit.

Asides from the obvious multitouch patent; there are others which are just vague and have been done before... Apple attempts to patent having contacts on the home screen of a phone?
http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/14/a...en-patent-but/

Just some more info... in respect to stopping products reaching end users...

http://www.engadget.com/2010/01/16/a...-nokia-phones/

-skplex

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

i honestly dont see how they infringed on hardware when they dont even have any similar hardware, unless a capacitive screen cant be used on a mobile device but other than that they dont have any grounds on that accusation.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

I read this interesting blog the other day about why is it everyone sues MS for monopoly but no one sues apple? think about it, from the software, to the end-user, they control ALL the streams of delivery AND the extraneous applications (read CRAppStore) delivered to end-users. Isn't that a monopoly? How come there's no suit to force them to let outsiders make applications for the icrap line and let them be installed independently of the CRAppstore?

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

i think apple just wants their name in the press, I don't think htc will actually pull any phones off the shelf.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Didnt Apple also lose to MS when MS released Windows 1.0 and Apple said it was too close to the Mac point and click?

Some things you cannot have a monopoly on...

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

From what I understand, multitouch is actually suspiciously NOT in the filings. I don't think Apple is ready to wage war about that yet as they would risk bringing in Google/Motorola/palm into the mix and forming a litigative alliance against Apple.

While companies should protect their IP and patents, a lot of what Apple patents aren't exact 'novel' ideas, but merely things they popularized. A lot of what the patents cover are so broad it just stifles the industry from making better products for consumers.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Translation:

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

I dont see how you can not infringe on patents in the tech community. How different can multitouch really be from one device to another? I know it can do different things with different motions, etc. but its not like you can revolutionize pinch to zoom.

So what it looks like crApple is doing is their same old same old, seeing what people want right now and charging you for it. thats how they make their money. I mean look at the imaxiPad. its an iphony with a big screen, and they are going to charge an arm and a leg for something that is not revolutionary at all. Want copy and paste? that will be ten bucks. Want to update your phone? that will be 30 bucks. Yet thats how crApple works, and they are good at it. The sheep are being herded yet again.

apple sues htc...
 

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8545976.stm
how freakin lame is this.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

ok explain something. The '849 Patent, entitled "Unlocking A Device By Performing Gestures On An Unlock Image," was duly and legally issued on February 2, 2010 by the United States Patent and Trademark
if they just got the patent last month how is this even on the table to use to sue. seems how tp2 has had the lock for wat a yr.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

this should be news on the front page of ppcgeeks...

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

srry forgot to add. about the gesture to unlock a screen. so that means they have to sue pocketsheild and throttle lock right?i mean apple didnt think this thru.most of the patents they r suein for r 2 yrs or less old. so they really dont have much of a chance.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

The whole point of a patent is so that people can't steal your invention for use without your permission. -HOWEVER-, you can easily make similar inventions with variants and patent it as your own work, happens all the time, and it's completely legal. If I make a light bulb, and then someone else makes a light bulb that's slightly different, we can both patent our light bulbs as our inventions and be awarded them. That doesn't stop companies from crying foul when a similar technology is developed but is different from the original.

Part of the problem of our patent system, however, is that once a patent is awarded, it can be transferred and sold, and never lapse regardless if the original inventor passes on, and what happens too often is that companies that purchase patents from their previous holders is that they get greedy and start looking for other ways to make money. Apple has likely recieved or purchased patents for various products and now that HTC has become a far greater known name than previously, Apple's looking to collect and they'll do anything they can to try to 'prove' HTC has stolen their patents. But unless HTC is using Multitouch exactly as it's provided in the iPhone, or creating UI's that are exactly like the iPhone, or using technology that's expressely provided in the iPhone, Apple doesn't have a leg to stand on. Though they may hope to tie HTC up in court to make it expensive.

It's sad when companies rely on patents for income and seem to be interested only in stifling competition or innovation, which is what Apple is famous for.

Re: apple sues htc...
 

As if my hatred against anything Apple isn't already dangerously near the limits of a healthy mindset!

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

I agree and before creating this thread I submitted the article/info to the PPC "submit a news tip" page.

-skplex

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

I was going to make the same comment, but you beat me to it. At the time, Apple complaining about Microsoft stealing their idea of a point and click interface was hilarious, considering Apple stole the idea from XPARC, who developed the x-windows interface for UNIX.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Basically this suit translates to; Other phones are gaining on the iPhone's cool factor, and Apple just can't have that, so they wanna crush the competition in any way possible.

Bastards.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Its simple for me I hate everything about Apple.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

I wonder what Apple's only carrier in the US thinks of this? ATT I don't think currently has any Android handsets but were believed to release a few of them this year (along with webOS devices). I wonder if the timing of this has more to do about ATT releasing Android handsets soon then HTC Android handsets in general. If an ATT iPhone customer wants an Android handset, it is a lot easier for them (if they like their carrier) to upgrade to an Android handset from ATT rather than jump ship to another carrier. They don't have to deal with possible early termination fees, difference in coverage, etc. Seems like Apple may be burning the only bridge they are standing on in the US, unless they were planning to release to other carriers soon.

???

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

I don't give a shit whether or not Apple has the rights to do this, or even if they had the patents first. I can now guarantee you that I will never in my life buy an Apple product, and I will never stand behind them. This is a low blow to a company who has innovated for years and has started to do things BETTER than Apple has, and of course, they feel threatened.

I read the article on Engadget and some of the patents they own are ridiculous. I find it completely insane that some of those things can even be patented. This one here is just stupid:

Rotation? You mean the same thing that's been available since before the 6700? Wow, Apple. F**k you.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

It is only a matter of time till a company patents breathing and then we all will have to pay royalties to breathe since that company would be credited with inventing breathing >.>

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

LOL next lawsuit will be worded thusly-

"Any phone that's better than the iPhone in any way is guilty of infringing on our patent of COOLNESS!"

@#$%in' tools. I hate Apple.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

I'm going to file a patent for every single piece of possible hardware used in personal computing and see what I can get. Then I'm going to sue everyone. Awesome.

Re: apple sues htc...
 

Forget the other web sites, we have that news on PPCG! Now go share your comments where the whole world can see; I did!

;)

http://www.ppcgeeks.com/2010/03/02/a...-infringement/

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Your gonna patent the passing of electrons from 1 atom to the next?

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

The 'iPatent, entitled "We stole it first,so you can't make it better than our stolen verison or we will sue you" was duly and legally issued on December 23, 2008 by the United States Patent and Trademark Office. A copy of the 'iPatent is attached hereto as Exhibit $.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

All i got to say, Apple patenting multi-touch is like getting a patent on the wheel. It can not and will not be allowed, they can bitch and mourn all they want. Like some said this is more a publicity stunt, after they pissed off ALOT of ppl with their shitty Ipad.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Now, now, now ... to understand what a patent covers, you must read the patent claims, which define the patent protection. And to properly understand the claim language, you have to read the specification (basically, the rest of the document) to see how the language is defined (it can deviate from regular meanings). I do this stuff for a living, btw.

But, I hear ya. The patents I looked over were uber lame. It's funny how Apple can bitch & complain behind such weak patents. I think they're gonna get their asses waxed in the end.

And yeah, like 99% of the folks here, I see it the same way: Apple is askeered that HTC is gonna take off, and the iPhone is gonna die. Oh well, it's called keeping up with the times, and here, that means Apple needs to get off their asses and come up with something that competes. The iPhone always did kinda suck, so maybe they can improve it? Do something, Apple, something that matters. Not just file infringement suits to try to parasitically drain financial gains of another. HTC!! Get some bug spray!!!

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

This.

The iPhone was competition when it first came out because it was thin and new. There is nothing great about the iPhone anymore, and there probably never will be.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

The '949 Patent, entitled "Touch Screen Device, Method, And Graphical User Interface For Determining Commands By Applying Heuristics," was duly and legally issued on January 20, 2009 by the United States Patent and Trademark Office. A copy of the '949 Patent is attached hereto as Exhibit B.

HTC should donate HP touch screen laptops to the court where the case is being heard. Their shark could nonchalantly mention at some point during the hearing that HP's had touch screen on their pc's before they had hard drives. ~20 years ago maybe?

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Too bad WinMo or HTC didn't patent the "cut and paste" function. Stupid idiots and their iTurds. F--- apple. And screw patents. Patents are what hurt competition in general. Patents should not be longer than 2 years now anyway.

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

im with you on that one thats why im just gonna read this one lol

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

LOL!! You have a clue about what you're talking about. If it weren't for patents, nobody would be spending millions on R&D to develop new technologies. Providing the incentive to invent v. the public benefit of inventors publicly disclosing their know-how ... those are the two interests. Yeah, I guess the people who drafted Art I, Section 8 of the US Constitution were just dumb-asses ... you can re-write it all since you seem to understand this stuff so well ... and maybe you have a cooked ROM to share too...

Re: Apple sues HTC for infringing 20 Patents...
 

Patents should not be 2 years..a patent is someone's invention and it allows you to benefit from your invention.

when you invent a device, usually it is in proto-type form and it takes 2 years just to get it out in public if lucky. If your patent did nto last a large company could just wait 2 years and rather then sharing hte profit from your invention run you out of business with money alone.

That said patents should not be put on stupid things..example..if a touch screen was invented and you add it to a mobile device and patent it..thats just dumb...There has to be a stricter limitations on the patent and of course patents should not be sold.