FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Why is it that we have to flash back to a stock ROM just to flash to a custom ROM and how do we go around doing this every time PLEASE!:protest::disgust:=D>

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I did not know you had to do that

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

ummm you must be doing something wrong you do not have to that. I have flashed from a nrg rom to mightys and back and fourth many times and have never flashed the stock rom.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

just flash the new rom you want and your done. Are you using a boot loader or flashing from the sd card?

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.5 (Microsoft Windows; PPC; Opera Mobi/17992; U; en))

You flash back to stock to make every setting stock.

Say you flashed mighty. He changed setting X from stock to something else.

Say you flash to Juicy next. Juicy never changed setting X so it is still stock.

Since you were on mighty before, setting X is changed still and then you complain that Juicy ROM sucks because it doesn't work right. That is because setting X isn't suppose to be changed but it is since mighty changed it.

So if you flash mighty then stock then juicy then setting X is right and Juicy ROM is not broken.

That is how I understand it.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

The rom flash dance, yeah annoying. You don't HAVE to do it, but most on here will recomend it from what I have seen.

I believe the reason is to rid the device of any possible remanants of a custom rom. Along the lines of a blank slate for the new rom.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

i only flash to stock if rom im running is having issues, other than that i dont flash stock first and thats on 2 tp2's.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

none of the cooks advocate this practice on the tp2s. after flashing, they do advocate a hard reset but not flashing back to stock each time...

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I flashed about 30 times on my TP2, but never did flash back to stock first. No problems unless self inflicted via installation of problematic cabs.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Flash back to stock. It only takes about fifteen extra minutes, and you save yourself and everyone on this forum's time when you try to troubleshoot. If you don't think it matters, go see the forums about random hard resets or other problems. If you don't do the dance, please don't waste anyone's time asking why something doesn't work.

That is like buying a car from the dealer, taking it home and swapping the engine with different one, putting the original back in, then asking the dealer to tell you what a noise is over the phone.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I think I've flashed my phone 60-80 times since the unlocker came out and I've flashed back to stock twice. Most times after a flash I am fine, but every once in a while I will get random locks or I will soft reset and it will be a hard reset. I just flash to stock and then put the custom ROM back on and everything is fine. But I don't flash to stock every time.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

You shouldn't have to do that. There were some corruption issues with early visual kitchens that made it necessary to sometimes flash stock first, but those issues are long gone.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Its all in your heads.........not neccessary.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

No - that's not the way it works. A ROM, when flashed, totally overwrites and replaces the contents of the prior ROM. Just like restoring an image to a hard drive.

(Again, there were issues with early VKs where that didn't always happen properly, but those were fixed last fall, and I've tried several ROMs and kitchens on my TP2, and have never flashed to stock)

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

OMG WITH ALL THE CAPITAL LETTER IN THE TITLE OF THIS THREAD I THOUGHT SOMETHING IMPORTANT WAS GOING ON LIKE THE SITE BURNED DOWN OR THERE WAS A CRAZY IMPORTANT ANNOUNCEMENT OR SOMETHING, i guess i should turn off my capslock.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Apparently there is mass delusion then...http://forum.ppcgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=96190

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

i still dont think its nessecary either. this thread you linked to is trouble shooting for random hard resets, not telling every one to do this just because. ive never experienced them and i flash about twice a week. ive only flashed back to stock when a rouge cab jankifies my phone. also, i used the elite team rom when they first dropped the hspl, and it changed my splash screen and it wouldnt change back. then i had to flash back to stock. the flash dance is bs.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I thinking you're confusing apples and oranges here.

The OP asks "Why is it that we have to flash back to a stock ROM just to flash to a custom ROM" - the answer is, you don't have to.

The thread you quote discusses a different issue - random hard resets, apparently caused by an hspl issue that can be fixed by unlocking the phone again.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

lets throw a poll up on this.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

whats up with you editing your comments then removing your edits. youve edited this post about 3 times now. how about just continuing the discussion new posts if you have something to say. we dont all wanna go rereading your every post.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Let me clarify: I don't think it is a common occurance to have any issue from flashing, but if the potential is there (the thread I referenced was just the first flashing related issue could think of, though I'm sure there are others), and the problem is easily prevented, then I see no reason not to do so.

I have flashed roms without flashing to stock, so I'm not saying it is a procedural requirement, but I personally have had stability issues that flashdancing cured. Not flashing stock may not have been the cause, but flashdancing removed the effect. I still feel it is a good idea.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I added the point I just clarified, but when I refreshed afterwards there were posts there, so I removed my edits and made a new post to keep the discussion flowing in order. Relax, I made sure the content is exactly the same as when the others posted for that reason.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Based on what you just said, I'd think you'd agree flashing stock would seem to be a good idea then. Custom ROMs are one big rogue cab, and even though it might not jankify your phone to the point it is broken, some things that can slow your phone or give unexpected results *CAN* linger, and provided one quick example. If ensuring that nothing does isn't worth your fifteen minutes, don't do it. YMMV.

That was my two cents, I'm not trying to come off as a jerk or attack anyone, my only point was that flashing stock fixes/prevents some issues. I'm done with the topic.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

if i'm not mistaken, someone said to hard reset, and then hard reset again to make sure you got everything out that shouldn't be there. i wanted to try mighty's updated ROM if it's done so i think i'll give this a go. i THOUGHT i had to flash back to stock but if i don't have to, i wanna hurry up and get the new ROM on my phone!

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I've flashed dozens of times(yeah,I'm a tad compulsive)and have occasionally had issues if I didn't revert to stock first. So my personal rule is stock first then flash. Using this method I have not had issues. I stick with what works for me, takes maybe ten extra minutes. I hate to get all my stuff/settings reloaded the way I like it on a new rom and then start having issues. But thats just me and my $.02. To each their own.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I have not seen one single speck of evidence, ever, that supports flashing to stock first. Yes, I have read plenty of posts from people saying they had a problem after flashing and they then flashed to stock, then back to the custom ROM, andthe problem was solved. It is much more likely the problematic ROM was corrupted in some way, and by reflashing they fixed the problem. Going to the stock had nothing to do with it....IT IS MYTH that has gained some legs in this forum. Remeber...ROM flashing completely overwrites the chip. The ability to flash at the file level is possible, but not done.

Dave

Wirelessly posted (Opera/9.80 (Windows Mobile; WCE; Opera Mobi/WMD-50369; U; en) Presto/2.4.13 Version/10.00)

I have to agree that flashing back to stock seems unecessary. I've lost count of how many times I flashed my last 3 WinMos and I never flashed back to stock. I've never had a random hard reset. I generally will hard reset after my first full boot, but that's about all I do extra.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I'm one such case where flash dancing solved my problem.

I ran the stock ROM for several months... finally caved in and built myself a ROM using calk's kitchen. All was well.

He released a new version of the kitchen and my phone crapped out. tmail.exe would lock up every 20 minutes or so and any texts after that point were lost, I'd have no way to know. The alarm would randomly not work. I had quite a few random problems. It happened with every build I made, no matter what options I chose.

I gave up fighting it after he had two more beta releases of the kitchen with no change. I was still having the same problems which no one else was having.

I flashed malatesta's ROM and didn't have those issues (built with SSK kitchen)... and it worked well for a while till it started locking up about a week later. The lockups got worse till it got stuck at launching Sense, then at the loading windows screen, then finally at the Touch Pro 2 screen. A hard reset brought it back for a day but it wasn't long before it acted up again.

I went back to Calkulin's kitchen because he had a new release. Built a ROM with a brand new sys/xip... Same problems as before!

Got frustrated and flash danced... poof, problems gone. I never used any other ROMs between having problems. It's been 4-5 days without major problems... which is a record since I started having issues almost a month ago. I'm about to make a week without a hard reset, FINALLY

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Once again, there is no evidence that flash dancing as you call it did anything. Afterall you reflashed what had become a poorly operating device.....Again....remember.....Flashing a ROM completely overwrites a chip. If you fllash to any ROM there is nothing remaining of the data that was on it before. :)

Dave

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

As a relative newcomer (a few months and 6 - 7 ROM flashes), the opinion as I have read it is that there is some difference in the 'flash' process on a 'signed' ROM (stock) and an unsigned ROM (custom). MightyMike had suggested the 'flash dance' toward the end of last year on the MightyROM forum because an unsigned ROM didn't always do a completely 'clean' flash on the NVRAM. Subsequent to this however, Mike also had a post that two 'hard flashes' (from the buttons) followed by a 'clear memory' before flashing (if you were having problems) was sufficient before flashing a custom ROM. Apparently there is some change in opinion on what is necessary even among the Cooks. I don't have enough experience personally to recommend one path over the other. Just an FYI from someone trying to come 'up to speed'.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I still see zero evidence that flashing from a stock ROM changes anything, signed or not. I can easily believe that on a rare occasion some data may not get wiped from any flash. However, what difference does it make if that data is from a stock ROM, and exactly what stock ROM? Sprint, Verizon, Telus? What difference does it make what stock ROM was originally on the device? If some data does get left behind what does it matter what ROM it came from? If data remains from the previous ROM, it is still a less then perfect flash regardless of what ROM it came from.

Anyway....I think I have made my point, I'm going to leave it for the rest of you to hass out if you wish. :)

Dave

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

My TP2 has not seen a stock ROM since 4 hrs after it got into my hands 3-4 months ago. I flash a custom ROM, letting it load completely then do a clear storage and don't have the random problems that people get into. Of course I may hard reset if I mess up with bad cab or something. Honestly, I don't care if you don't do it the same way I do. If you want to flash back to stock everytime go ahead, I just know this works for me.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I flash to stock whenever I'm having problems with ROMs that nobody else is experiencing, I do find that doing that a lot of my problems decease.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Always flash stock if you are switching ROMs. ROMs leave things behind (startup animations, settings, radios, etc) that do not get cleared when you flash a new ROM. Hence you may end up with bits of both ROMs. If you do not want this, flash stock between ROMs. 80% of ROM flashers problems come from not following directions, 10% from not flashing stock, and the other 10% is probably the ROM.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

I don't know if this is all voodoo or not, i lean towards yes and that being said, I'm way too lazy/impatient to flash back to stock between every ROM. I mean, I'm just gonna flash it again in less than a week anyway let's be honest here haha.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

That is not at all correct. It's amazing at the amount of mis-information regarding this topic.

Startup animations and settings are part of the new ROM.

Radios are almost always a separate flash.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

back in the mogul days, I've seen leftover remnants from other roms when flashing without stock flashing first.

I personally will flash to stock first just to be on the safe side, it's not worth the headache to me to "guess" why a rom is having problems wehn I'm out and about.

Wirelessly posted (Touch Pro 2: Opera/9.7 (WindowsMobile; PPC; Opera Mobi/35267; U; en; Presto/2.1.1))

I guess I didn't directly say it but I must have flashed ROMs 30+ times and I was still having problems. I wasn't flashing the same rom every time, nor was I even using the same kitchen every time. Every flash was a fresh built rom, every couple of days was a fresh copy of the kitchen. This went on for weeks - I had a phone I couldn't really use.

The flashing process has the ability to modify more than just the ROM space as far as the OS is concerned. What about flashing a radio? Or flashing an nbh that has a radio included? Its the same nbh, but one writes the radio too.

A flash can't totally erase the chip - you would lose your radio or would have to integrate a radio in every cooked ROM... just as an example. I am betting it's more complex than a dumb flash, you know, completely erase and re-write. It is probably optimized to transfer as little data as possible to save time.

Thus the flash dance.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

Alright, i have been watching this thread for the better part of today...
that being said, I have been using windows mobile since 2003...and owned more devices that I have fingers and toes...

All that being said here is some facts for everyone...yes facts whether you believe them or not...

1) Flashing a custom ROM is not the same as flashing a stock ROM. The stock ROM does a "cleaner flash" then a custom one does. Why exactly is a topic for another thread.

2) Remnants of a older ROM can be present when flashing a new ROM on top of it. Nothing as big as a splash screen, they are little bugs that you may never even notice. A setting not sticking. Phone hanging. etc.

3) You don't need to flash a stock ROM ever - unless you are having weird bugs that no one else is having. Because, 9 times out of 10, that will fix your weird bugs.

Re: FLASHING TO STOCK JUST TO FLASH CUSTOM ROM's
 

LOL, you are right around the mis-information, because almost your entire post is misinformation (you are right about radios ALMOST always being a separate flash).

A stock ROM will reset everything (radio, startup, settings, etc) to stock (i.e., not someone's custom versions). If you just move to another custom ROM, you can have the radio from the old ROM (or old radio if you flashed one seperate), the old startup animations, or other things residual from the previous ROM. A new ROM does NOT change these things by default, ONLY if the chef explicitly puts them in.

You should try cooking, flashing, and learning for a bit longer before you say things that can have an impact on people. I know what I said is true because I have had it happen to me several times, which is why I now flash to stock between different ROMs and recommend everyone else do the same. I have had old startup animations and residual files that corrupted the next ROM I put on. Also, the stock ROM for my Vogue resets the radio to stock also.

If someone has an issue with a ROM, I WILL NOT help them until they have flashed to stock first and reflashed (unless it is an obvious issue).