? about rom size vs storage and program sizes/total

[saridnour]

A little unclear on what is happening here and want to make sure I understand it correctly.

If you remove multiple items from the rom to decrease the rom size, it is still repacked into a 64 meg .nba/.nbf file. So does adding things to the Rom affect the devices Storage and Program memories "in use". As in does the ROM still take up the same space with all it's bits or is what is in it extracted to memory only? Trying to figure out if its best to pack what I need in the Rom or load after the device is booted.

Anyone care to elaborate on what impact the devices Storage and Program memories?

I keep reading mixed information and want to make sure I have this clear


Thanks,
Andy Ridnour

[Bushrod]

The more you can put into ROM, the better. For example, I have two large programs in ROM now and I have nearly 38 MB free Storage.

Off topic here, can you share your Crossbow RDP client module?

[luv2chill]

The ROM space is partitioned so you can't reduce the size of your ROM ad expect that space to be available as storage memory.

But as Bushrod said, it's best to put as much into ROM as you can as otherwise you will take up storage memory if you install after the fact. The tradeoff is that for frequently-updated apps you may need to keep updating your ROM (as opposed to when they're in storage memory you can uninstall the old version and install the new one).

I second the request for the Crossbow RDP client. I also sent you a PM about it.

Thanks.

[schettj]

Let's back up and try for a simpler explaniation

You have four things internally in your 6700

Radio Firmware Flash Rom - nothing you can do here
OS Firmware Flash Rom - 64MB
Extended Flash Rom - 10MB
Internal Ram - 64MB

Now, you can 'cook your own rom' - which means you can pre-install applications you would normally install into internal RAM or your Card, or if you unlock it, your Extended ROM, into the OS ROM. That's good for several reasons

(1) - it is always available, just like if you installed it into RAM
(2) - it does not need to be re-installed on a COLD BOOT
and
(3) - it does not use any internal RAM when not running, as an app would if installed in internal RAM *

When people speak of freeing up RAM because they moved something into the OS ROM, it's because of (3) - there are lots of apps and stuff like ringers and themes that really have to be internal (RAM or ROM) to work well, so we're forced to install them into RAM - one big one is .NET 2.0 - you can run that off a card, but it does not run well there, and even then takes a couple meg of internal RAM just to install.

As the poster above said, the downside of putting apps into ROM is you have to re-build and re-flash your ROM if you need to update the app to a new version.

* and I am not sure if the 6700 can do execute in place for ROM-based executables... if it does, then OS-ROM based stuff will also not use as much RAM even when running. But I don't think that's the case with the 6700.

[saridnour]

So the ROM does not affect the the devices Storage and Program memory? I thought the image was extracted to memory? Humm.. going to have to re-thing my image. May need to stick VC1.6 and WisebarLite as these don't get updated often into my personal ROM.

As to the RDP bits, just pull them from one of the WM6 distros posted on the XDA site. I do contract work with MS onsite so I can not chance handing out un-released MS bits. The list of the bits and keys are in the other post. I am walking a fine line with some of this stuff as it is

-saridnour

[luv2chill]

I would just add one thing--when you use the word RAM in your explanation you are actually referring to part of the Flash-ROM aka Storage Memory. The phone does have actual RAM (aka Program Memory) that is only used temporarily while things are running.

Summary for clarification:

There is 128 MB of Flash ROM in the Apache. It is currently partitioned into three separate parts which behave differently:

1. ROM = Partition that contains your OS and can only be written to by a flashing process, otherwise it is read-only (this is what we are customizing here).

2. Storage Memory = Partition to/from which you can write and read files.

3. Extended ROM (extrom) = ~10GB---(EDIT: 10MB derrr) partition very similar to Storage Memory originally intended only for carrier customizations. However, if unlocked and unhidden, will act just like a storage card.

Then, completely separate from all of that is 64 MB of SDRAM (aka Program Memory). This is volatile (i.e. not persistent) and is only used by the OS to store files while they are being used. Nothing is permanently stored here.

[ImCoKeMaN]

Originally Posted by luv2chill

3. Extended ROM (extrom) = ~10GB partition very similar to Storage Memory originally intended only for carrier customizations. However, if unlocked and unhidden, will act just like a storage card.

I think you mean ~10MB otherwise we wouldn't need a storage card at all

[schettj]

D'oh

Yeah. 64k RAM aka program memory and 64k storage flash memory.

Yep. My bad. Sometimes slip into Windows CE 2003 mode

See Settings, Memory, Main

"Storage" is the internal storage flash memory "Program" is RAM

By moving stuff you had to install in the Internal Store into the OS ROM, you should get more available "Storage". "Program" is unlikely to change at all.

[luv2chill]

Right!

And thanks for the correction ImCoKeMaN... A dumb error on my part, but wouldn't it be nice?

[Bushrod]

Did you get the rdp to work with a manual install? I can't get it to start. Maybe I'll try it as a module.

I've got most of a wisbar lite module ready. Just need to build and test. I'm breaking out the laptop now.