Copyright notice
 

There always seem to be a few people that feel the need to screw things up for everyone else by trying to turn a dime off of someone else's labor.


Much of the software items in the kitchen are free for personal use. Many are NOT free for commercial use. DO NOT SELL THE KITCHEN, THE TOOLS DISTRIBUTED WITH THE KITCHEN, OR ROMs MADE FROM IT. You WILL be in violation of numerous copyrights.

I can't speak for all the copyright holders, but I know Microsoft and I pursue copyright infringement aggressively.

Sorry to hear about the very stupid people charging for the very hard work you amazing folks at PPC Geeks have put into the WM6 release.

We all benefit so much from all your hard work and we really appreciate it, I hope this does not discourage you guys from all the great work you do.

I am an attorney so if the moderators feel the need to send a letter to one of these Bozos to tell them to cease and decist, I will be happy to send one on my letterhead.

Hopefully, this will keep this greed to a minimum!

Why not just post their contact info as there is no limit to what kind of damage the Raging Idiots of the world can do to them.

Then again, there would then be copycats from the publicity that this can be done....then again,
that's what we're advertising now...

People are ridiculous. BUT if the people that are buying this stuff, would take the time to read the readme's etc. and weren't so damn lazy --- they could do the kitchens themselves and the upgrades.

Plain and simple -- we as a global nation are becoming fat and lazy.

Sorry.. I'm off my soapbox.

I am in aww of the greatness that is performed here at this site, but i was honestly wondering the difference between someone charging for this stuff and those who creating it asking for donations. don't get me wrong they deserve it, but i mean aren't they then infringing on microsoft and others? just an honest question. Again I'm against those who didnt help trying to profit, but just wondering the legal diferences?

Obviously, if you created it in it's entirety, you can do whatever you want. The question is whether you are depriving a license owner of revenue which their license entitles them to and they haven't actively undermined. Nobody here is representing they made WM6, so you're not "stealing credit" (a form of compensation). Nobody here is representing that they are providing a WM6 license (obviously a direct violation). Nobody here is distributing copyrighted works in a form different than the same work is readily available to the general public (and that's the key for WM5/WM6 - it's freely available to end users as a PPC ROM from your carrier exactly as it's distributed here).

Nobody is requesting donations for providing another's copyrighted work in it's freely available form. When donations are requested, it's because there was some product seperately identifiable from any licensed work of another.

What we commonly see on e-bay and other sites, however, is people charging for someone else's product (obviously an infringement for non-freeware products)(sometimes people even represent the work as their own!). Because they are using another's work as a revenue generating enterprise (either through selling it unaltered or through it's integral nature to the product they are selling or integral nature to production of the produt they are selling) their usage is a "non personal use" and different licensing terms apply. Many of the products in the kitchen have specific licensing terms related to such commercial usage. WM5/WM6 and BuildOS are two such examples.

As the admin Peter Poelman said after being forced to take off the roms from the XDA-Developers site: "The vendor giveth, and the vendor taketh away."

Obviously the vendors can (and do) force their products off websites.
Regardless of popular opinion or good judgment, they have the right.
The biggest problem with being a mobster is other mobsters.
Pots calling kettles black...lawyers calling others greedy... everyone is right, and everyone is wrong. Amidst the complexity is the simplicity.

[QUOTE=Raging Idiot;142938]As the admin Peter Poelman said after being forced to take off the roms from the XDA-Developers site: "The vendor giveth, and the vendor taketh away."

I definately think anyone not involved in the great work done here recieving funds is wrong and disgusting, however to be totally legit and legal the end user would have to supply their lisenced rom, MS could come here at anytime and shut down the rom production.

That being said they could not stop someone from creating a program that modifies original roms into the base roms used in the kitchens as long as the original roms are supplied by the end user. You could even go as far as to call it "Base Rom Creator for Windows Mobile", as long as the initial rom is provided elsewhere it is legal as far as the authors program would be concerned. Legality on the end users part though could come into question if they are using the program to modify roms that they don't own or have license to use.

Not to steal the thread or take away from the importance of what gguruusa is saying just adding my understanding of how this all works as I used to work for MS as a supervisor for multiple consumer departments that dealt extensively with licensing and copyrights over the past 6 years.

yes and no. As long as the rom used is freely available and is distributed in its freely available form, no rights have been infringed upon. Doesn't mean you have the right to use or modify the rom, just that the distribution of it didn't infringe on anyone.

That's why MS frowns on custom ROM hosting - they aren't the freely available form.

I guess this is just one example of what you are talking about.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Windows-Mobile-6...QQcmdZViewItem

http://forum.ppcgeeks.com/showthread.php?t=11452

Here is a thread we have which is discussing this same topic. I posted the ebay process for IProp infringement and I have A_C ready to file the claim for his software.

**IF YOU ARE A DEVELOPER WHO IS HAVING YOUR WORK STOLEN AND SOLD ON EBAY PLEASE READ THE LINK AND FILL OUT THE FORM**

I continue to file reports daily with ebay, please assist me and do the same.

Nice work cano. Just thought this topic need a little more exposure. I think it is a real shame.

FYI, that guy you linked to has been reported several times (i report him daily).

When i got formal advice i was instructed the best course of action is to get as many individuals continually reporting so that via shear volume it becomes apparent to ebay (also annoying) which hopefully influences some sort of action.

I have successfully had listings removed thus far (not all, some).

Dont get me wrong i support an ebayers desire to generate revenue, just not at the expense of other peoples so very hard work with no regard to credit financial or otherwise (can i outright say stealing?).

Thank you for your compliment :-)

Re: Copyright notice
 

here is a violation http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...id=p2759.l1259

Re: Copyright notice
 

This is not a violation, he is selling the actual phone and one of his selling points is that it is upgraded to WM6, there is nothing wrong with this.

Re: Copyright notice
 

The guy selling the iphone themes for ppc's on ebay was hilarious! He is selling the programs made here and then sending his customers to ppcgeeks for tech support.Lol!!! If I was one of the creators here and saw my work sold on ebay, I would be furious!

Re: Copyright notice
 

The iPhone theme was pretty funny, that I can understand. Some people are just blatant idiots. Who knows what else they try to cop off as theirs and try selling it.

Re: Copyright notice
 

Sadly, it's the e-bay scammers that are the cause of the forced login and donation screens.

Re: Copyright notice
 

This is probably a never ending battle. As a new comer to the PPC world, I bought a used 6700 on eBay. When searching for a PPC I also came across the $10 upgrade to WM 6.0 offers. At the time I didn't have any idea where the upgrades came from, but I had an idea that they were available free somewhere, because no Microsoft upgrade is ever that cheap. I went Googling and found this wonderful site.

I can definitely see how people unaware of where this stuff comes from would buy the upgrades on eBay. On thought that went through my head was, is it worth my time hunting to save $10. I have a strong embedded device background on other platforms, so I went hunting. I'm sure many novice users will just fork out the $10 and never go looking.

Re: Copyright notice
 

What was bad was when they started selling a link to the software as if they had produced it themselves. That's pure scamming.

Re: Copyright notice
 

So, is having wm6.1 in the kitchen in violation of microsoft copyright laws? I remember Microsoft lawyers approached the guys at XDA about a year ago on that. They couldn't have any roms on their site, and their FTP was mysteriously always down for a while.

Just a question, not wanting to start any hate...

Re: Copyright notice
 

Thats just Microsoft being a ditz about their products. We had a used electronic shop that bought Microsoft products used, before they came out with the activation. They forced them to give every Microsoft program to them or otherwise they would be hearing from there money hungry greedy lawers.

Re: Copyright notice
 

I would just like to be clear on an issue. If I chose to sell an apache on Ebay upgraded to wm6 or 6.1 (non stock rom) is that considered a violation? or "morally" wrong?

Re: Copyright notice
 

If you're selling the phone, and it happens to have wm6/6.1, that's considered ok. The idea is you are selling the phone, not the upgrade. The upgrade needs to be free or you violate lots of licensing terms. Don't try to charge noticeably more because it's upgraded - that's the same as charging for the upgrade.

Re: Copyright notice
 

Hi, thanks for clearing this up. I just dont want to be the rip the credit from the greats over hear and xda for all thier hard work.... What do you think about what this seller is selling

http://cgi.ebay.com/PPC6800-XV6800-H...QQcmdZViewItem

Re: Copyright notice
 

I think hes charging to put it on the phone not for the upgrade. but im not sure. Not even that i wouldnt want to send a $300 phone into someone i dont know.

Re: Copyright notice
 

Totally illegal, as the product is integral to the service being performed. He'll end up being sued and owing more than he earned.

Re: Copyright notice
 

So how do we pursue that?

Re: Copyright notice
 

It's already being pursued.

Re: Copyright notice
 

Good! No one should profit off of someone elses hardwork.

Re: Copyright notice
 

Hi everybody,

Just wanted to weigh in that i actively report ebay users daily who are violating ebay's T&C for intellectual property.

I have even gone as far as to get ebay users to attempt to pay AC royalties for sales of his slide2unlock program.

Its been a while since i posted, been swamped with projects and travelling, but i take time daily to report users in violation.

Please understand it takes a bit for ebay to respond, in which time the user may have sold several items before their account is suspended.

Re: Copyright notice
 

I am brand new to this site today, that being said, I've banged code for over twenty years. I have a handle on operating systems basic operation and house keeping. I LOVE LINUX!:headbang: What is required to make a linux version???? I have not gone to the kitchen yet, between homework and work, I stay busy. Eventhough I walked saturday, I still have a couple of classes to finish up, but after then I'd be very interested in getting involved with creating a totally open source phone program based on linux. I do not have a clue on what all the team did to get these rom's ready, but I'd be happy to help after july 17th, 2008~ With linux, there is no question over ownership. I write linux for arm processors imbedded linux. I have no clue over the overhead of the phone, it would be nice though.

Re: Copyright notice
 

This thread is dedicated to reporting and following up on folks who attempt to profit off of others intellectual property. Most commonly we see this on ebay with older equipment running newer custom built ROMs and custom developed apps which belong to a different developer.

In the case of AC with Slide2Unlock many people package his "iphone" style home screen unlocker with other software to build a Windows Mobile "iphone" interface and then sell it without paying royalties, licensing or even having the most basic permissions.

As for Linux....

I have owned several WM Ipaqs which we have successfully put Linux on. As you may know its all about the drivers and a free kernal of memory :mrgreen:

I recommend you do a search for your linux topics and/or start a new thread to discuss. There may be other threads dedicated to your idea.

Re: Copyright notice
 

I tried to sell my sd memory card on ebay and the ad was removed next day due to a bullsh!t report of somesort of wrongdoing. The report was extremely vague on reason and basically designed to thwart any relatiation.
I figured it was because i used a stock photo of the card (perhaps copyrighted) so i used a different pic... ad was removed again even faster than the first.
Makes no sense when these cards are sold there by the thousands, and I have great feedback ratings.
Anyhow, this was just to say that Ebay can respond fast, just depends on...something.

Re: Copyright notice
 

Sorry for taking it off topic.......

Re: Copyright notice
 

So, sorry if this has already been gone over but I really didn't want to read through all the pages (I know, let the tar and feathering begin). So does this mean that when I move on to a new phone that I have to flash it back to the OEM ROM? I mean, I know MS could throw a tizzy since Sprint and/or UTSTarcom never paid for a 6.1 license for my device, but would the BuildOS team be pissed for spreading their work? If so, I understand, but I have put so much time into fine tuning my ROM that I think someone else deserves to have it when I am done. Ok, now i'm just rambling. My shift is almost over and its been a long day. lol

Re: Copyright notice
 

It's in your best interest to put the OEM ROM back on your device for a few reasons.
1. Your provider could deny an exchange if it was for a claim that the device wasn't functioning correctly.
2. Your modified ROM might have some (personal) information embedded that you really don't want to share.
3. If the device is going to get refurbished, they're going to wipe it and reinstall an OEM ROM anyway (although I have heard of this not happening, and I once got a refurbished device that had the previous owners contacts & calendar still in it; he was a Sprint rep).
4. I don't think anyone is pissed for this getting spread around, but if your provider decided to make an issue of it for some reason, they might try to take some action against PPCGeeks. I can't imagine how this would play out, but why take the chance?

Re: Copyright notice
 

Just depends on what your going to do w/ the phone. If your returning it, I'd suggest to returning it OEM

Re: Copyright notice
 

Yeah, hands down I would go OEM ROM if I was dealing with the manufacturer, etc. I mean like if I wanna post my phone for sale on here or ebay, what have you, that I can leave my sweet *ss ROM on it. I'm really not worried about personal info, even with a stock ROM it leaves your NAM info and whatnot. If it really bugs me, I can manually remove the info.