I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

With the specifications being superior to that of the iPhone, why the heck can't my (IMO) Vastly superior phone do something as simple as scrolling down a website or contact list nearly as smoothly as an iPhone? I've never seen this question asked or answered... Is the display and cpu power not superior to the apple product?

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

HTC devices that use the Qualcomm MSM 7201(a?) are known to be massive underperformers in the video department. It's nothing new. What's funny is the Android G1, running the same hardware, and a Linux OS gets some decent video performance. not sure of the #s though..

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

i thought it was because the iphone is using the superior(?) PowerVR MBX gpu for optimized video acceleration. imo, that's the only thing about the iphone that's better than the TP. apple can't sell an "inferior" product without having it look more superior than the competition :disgust:

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

It's because HTC makes some really ****ty Video AND cpu drivers for windows mobile.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

it is annoying how much better the iphone/touch are for inet browsing.

I have a second gen touch & I use it connected with WMwifirouter for browsing. The big beautiful super responsive screen & safari browser totally blows away the TP (I don't care what browser you're using)

Not only that, the touch screen is fine/visible out in the bright sun where the TP is virtually unuseable.........

~John

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

I guess I just dont get it, even the G1 looks great when scrolling, and thats also quallcomm...

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

well, it's like what a couple of people already mentioned. even though its the same hardware the G1 manages to do it better probably because it has better graphics drivers and thats just operating system dependent. i would imagine (assume) the google took some time to put some decent drivers in android whereas microsoft has left it up to manufacturers in that department and for some reason htc just hasn't really bothered, yet (hopefully)

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Qualcomm has a patent issue with HTC over their video drivers.

So HTC is too cheap to pay Qualcomm in order to improve our graphics performance.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

wow, didnt see that info coming, makes sense though
i wonder if they dont wanna pay up because theyre talking to nvidia :wink:

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Wishful thinking.
The MSM chipset is manufactured by Qualcomm. Nvidia has no 'jurisdiction' :(

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

I know it's Qualcomm's chip and if you want anything to do with it you have to pay the man, i was trying to reference further down the line with Tegra which is simultaneous CPU/GPU, if HTC were to jump on that they could almost tell Qualcomm to take a hike and why pay royalites on graphics drivers if youre changing platforms anyhow
and yes i know that is all pure speculation but it only makes sense for HTC to use Tegra

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Kinda , its a matter of a license fee. Qualcomm made a CPU with a all in one solution. CPU, GPU, GPS, FM Radio,BT, and so on. When HTC decided to put the 7200 CPU they were able to make a whole line of ppc with different specs without changing the architecture of the motherboard and sell them at different price points depending on whats enabled and disabled. One of the critical elements were left disabled on all the 7200A cpu on all PPC's exept on the G1. that critical element was the accelarrated d3d drivers. Qualcomm felt that it was not necessary since the ppc runs fine without them and HTC saved a boatload of money. The g1 was a different story, it has the same cpu but Google paid for the drivers and thats why its sooo much smoother than our own ppc. So who do you blame? Qualcomn, HTC, Sprint, Microsoft or the consumer? Well its a bit all all of the above, Qualcomn for creating a all in one solution cpu with the ability to enable and disable off abilities and charging top dollars for the sugar. Htc for being cheap and not paying for the critical d3d drivers that would make this ppc sooo much better. Sprint for not Paying for what HTC should have paid and sell a PPC worthy in calling it a flagship phone. Microsoft for not paying the fee for the d3d drivers so wm 6.1 could run smoother.And finally us the consumer for buying yet another PPC with missing d3d drivers for the 4th time. Mogul, Touch, Diamond and currently the Pro. And even after knowing that the PPC has the same issue with the new handset we still go out a buy it. Now, with the upcoming Diamond2 and Pro 2...... they both also run on this same 7200A CPU but with a bigger screen. Guess whats going to happen? We will all run out a buy it like suckers and complain about it how terrible slow and unsmooth the scroll is. But Qualcomn, HTC,Sprint and Microsoft will just smile and get thier pockets full of more money and point fingers at each other. If we all would have stopped buying HTC ppc's after we got suckered into the Mogul away from our 6700 then we would have had a properly working Diamond and pro right now with smooth and better than the iphone experience. But noooooooo, instead they are shoveling yet another crappy PPC down out throat (diamond2 & Pro2). I miss my 6700. I vowed not to buy another htc PPC with missing d3d drivers until either Snapdragon is out of another manufacture comes out with a better ppc with proper drivers. So, please evryone.... dont buy the PRO2 or Diamond2. If those sell.. then we will be screwed again on the Pro3 and diamond3.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Great find! I knew all of that up until the point you mentioned Snapdragon. So I did a quick google search and wam, there it is... the specs for the new hardware platform being introduced by Qualcomm. It looks amazing, great news!

As for Android, if you boot up Linux on your HTC, you will immediately notice the difference in video quality. It's like night and day. It still doesn't beat the fluid motion of scrolling on the iPhone, but it's much better than the way it comes stock. My buddy and I were talking about how the same device could perform so differently with Android Vs. WM6.1, and conclusively decided it had to be driver support. I hate to "beat a dead horse," but to sum it up, your device is capable of what you want, but they dropped the ball when it came to supporting that feature... and when I say they, I'm mostly referring to Microsoft for not including the drivers in their OS.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Ya.. theres blame to go around all of them.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Think about this then. How come the "All Programs" menu in the TouchFlo interface works very smoothly. That is the kind of smoothness I want especially on the contacts menu. I hate the clicking.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

I am sorry I should have bben a bit more clear. Tf3d is hardware accelarated. It does have a specialized driver that enables a few items to be accelarated including the tf3d video player. Qualcomn and HTC have excellent control of this driver. Over at XDA.. they have been cracking at it but with little success.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Oh! This explains SO much. I'd noticed that scrolling is extremely inconsistent between different apps.

Of the tweaks for 'increased screen sensitivity' -
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Drivers\TouchPanel\PressureThre shold
and
HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\Software\OEM\TFLOSettings\Finge rPressure
does one apply to TF3D only and the other to WM apps?

(BTW - my settings for these entries are whatever the 'align screen' sets them to - I've never found any values to work well for me)

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Why can't someone get the drivers from the G1 and perhaps see what commands it uses to access the hardware? I don't know a whole lot about the issue, but I guess reverse engineering isnt as easy as it sounds? What about the TP2 and Diamond2, do they both also suffer the same video issue? Is the hardware not almost identical?

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Smoothly compared to the rest of the OS, but still not 60fps like the iPhone. We have a long way to go...

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

F*** the iPhone. Over hyped crap. They brag about all their apps and blah blah but we can get almost all the same apps or like apps for free, and we have customization.



Sorry for the off topic rant.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

That has nothing to do with the scrolling. Why do people feel so insecure about their phone choice? I chose the TP for a variety of reasons, not the iPhone. But its video performance is far superior, as well as the general speed and response of the OS.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Its not really insecurity, we just want our phones to be even better. Its human nature to always desire more.

About FPS:

Has anyone seen the older flip phones with VERY low refresh rates? I mean, if you move the phone from side-to-side rapidly you can see the flicker? Is it possible that the refresh rate on our devices are lower than the iPhone's? [driver issue aside]

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

lol 60fps? Any reason you landed on this number or is this just what you remember your fps gets locked at when gaming on lcd with vsync on?

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

you're not exactly adding anything to this discussion.

Personally I'm sick of the nerd rage over such stupid ****.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Hence the reason I said sorry for the off topic rant. If you don't like "nerd rage" / discussion, then go somewhere else.

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

Not trying to start anything, but did you read what you wrote before posting it?

Uhh... this thread is about the TOUCH PRO, in the TOUCH PRO forum, in a site dedicated to Pocket PCs like the TOUCH PRO. There's an off-topic forum for 'nerd-rants' about the iPhone.

Just because you apologize in your post doesn't give you the right to tell someone to 'go somewhere else' when you're the one that's out of place.

Again, no disrespect, but come on...

Re: I have a question about TP Scrolling...
 

point taken.